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  • 7A cams

    @ Mark H. and anybody who might be interested,

    Exhaust Cam

    I already sayd in another thread 7A exhaust cam looks significantly more "high performance" minded than 3B/ABY/AAN and also of the ADU one.
    And this couldn't be different because it cames off a NA engine wich needs much more "aggressive" timing for best possible VE.
    Gains of using the 7A ex-cam on the turbocharged engine (knowing there still is no overlap, which we don't want on a forced induction engine) will probably be percentually less than the worstening of using the turbo cam on the NA engine, but it should anyway give some good gain in the mid to high rpm.


    Intake Cam

    Compared to the turbocharged ones:

    Given I don't have lift among the other parameters (which might make some rilevant difference), timing is as follows (always according to data I have)

    7A: opens 6° before TDC; closes 38° after BDC; duration = 224°

    3B/ABY/AAN: opens 3° after TDC; closes 25° after BDC; duration = 202°

    ADU: opens 13° after TDC; closes 35° after BDC; duration = 202°


    1) All three of them (coupled with 7A exhaust cam) won't give overlap:

    7A = -3°
    3B/ABY/AAN = -12°
    ADU = -22°

    2) ADU one seems to me will give too much delay on intake valve opening;

    3) 7A gives sensibly longer duration (while being a little "at the limit" with overlap) therefore giving higher flow gains (thus VE) expecially on high rpm.



    "Reading" the timing from a theoretical point of view, since the use of the 7A exhaust cam already pushes VE optimization to higher rpm (together with rising stresses of valvetrain with higher lift) I would personally chose both intake and exhaust 7A cams.
    Alternatively I think the 3B/ABY/AAN intake cam would be even better then the ADU one.



    As I sayd many times, though, things on real life might change a bit, maybe due to not considering some other parameter right now.
    So if anybody has something to say about this and/or has infos and feedback on weather using one option better than another and why, pleas tell.


    Marco

  • #2
    Marco, what about the NM cams??? Could you source me a pair of those in Italy? I know there's been loads of 2.0 20v engines sold there in comparison with the rest of Europe...
    '98 Silver Grey 2.7T S4, dual 2.75" turbo back exhaust with no cats, FMIC, BIG injectors, 10 Bar motorsport fuel pump, modded RS4 turbos, tubular exhaust manifolds, custom intakes, RS4 MAF, Bilstein PSS9, H&R ARBs, 19" BBS CH, custom remap, 511 BHP/505ft-lbs

    www.MRCTuning.com
    info@MRCTuning.com
    Workshop Directions

    Comment


    • #3
      NM cams look to me to be a compromise between 7A and 3B/ABY/AAN.

      Only a little bit more on the "higher rpm" performances than the ADU:

      INTAKE:

      opens at 0° TDC; closes 32° after BDC; duration 212°

      EXHAUST:

      opens 35° before BDC; closes 3° before TDC; duration 218°; lift 9.6 mm

      No overlap: -3°



      Would be interesting to have hub hights (lift) for the intake cams too. Anyone?


      Marco



      P.S. Mihnea, I'll try to find some NM cams (I have them coming from my NM engine), but scrapers I know (given they have some) will probably only sell together with full head.... so might not be cnvenient.

      By the way, how much are ABY-ADU-7A-NM cams worth new?

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Pisobiker
        By the way, how much are ABY-ADU-7A-NM cams worth new?
        7A exhaust cam - £280 new.
        S2,RS2,S4 WB,RS4,S4 B8,RS6 C5,RS6 C6,R8

        Comment


        • #5
          Marco,

          thanks mate, this goes a long way to helping me choose which combination to use, I'll try to find out the different inlet cam hub heights for comparison between them.

          Cheers ,


          Mark.

          P.S. @ Mihnea you know someone using both 7A's dont you (Joern) ?
          Mark - Modded

          Comment


          • #6
            another thread to hold onto
            I chose not to choose life: I chose something else. And the reasons? There are no reasons. Who need reasons when you've got quattro?

            Comment


            • #7
              Yep Mark, that was Joern who's using them both for 420 HP and 500Nm...


              Cheers,

              Mihnea

              Originally posted by Mark Halligan
              Marco,

              thanks mate, this goes a long way to helping me choose which combination to use, I'll try to find out the different inlet cam hub heights for comparison between them.

              Cheers ,


              Mark.

              P.S. @ Mihnea you know someone using both 7A's dont you (Joern) ?
              '98 Silver Grey 2.7T S4, dual 2.75" turbo back exhaust with no cats, FMIC, BIG injectors, 10 Bar motorsport fuel pump, modded RS4 turbos, tubular exhaust manifolds, custom intakes, RS4 MAF, Bilstein PSS9, H&R ARBs, 19" BBS CH, custom remap, 511 BHP/505ft-lbs

              www.MRCTuning.com
              info@MRCTuning.com
              Workshop Directions

              Comment


              • #8
                Would be interesting to have hub hights (lift) for the intake cams too. Anyone?
                Spent ages trying to find out about these tonight.....drew a blank, plenty mentioned about the exhaust hub heights but nothing (that I could find) for the inlets :mad: .

                Mark.
                Mark - Modded

                Comment


                • #9
                  Darnit, i wish i'd taken the inlet cam too when i got my 7a cam from the scrapper, probably could have got that for 10 quid too
                  but its been crushed

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Do Schric do a performance cam for the S2/RS2, i looked at them years ago for my Coupe 2.0 16v and they were about 300 quid for the pair, i have never heard any bad reports about Schric, and theyt are supposed to be among the best available, as they are much harder than Piper/Kent cams which are only surface hardened a few thou. Has anyone else had any experience with these?
                    Graham
                    Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler.--:Albert Einstein

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      7A Inlet cam lift.

                      Guys,
                      I have measured as best I can, the total lobe height and the base circle dimension. Subtracting one from the other to get the lift, I make it 9.6mm(47.65-38.05). Was expecting it to be more than that.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thanks for the info twoqu,

                        will mesure ABY one to compare with, once I get home.


                        Marco

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          From my mesurements 3B intake cam has 8.3mm lift, so the 9.6mm of the 7A seems good to me.
                          Of course to be totally sure about real timing area we should know the real opening and closing law of the camshafts. A very "fast" opening and closing leads, at same duration, to a greater effective opening area.

                          Would be nice to know. Any of the mechanics here have the equipment to take a mesurement of lift degree by degree for both intake and exhaust cams from 3B/ABY/AAN, ADU, 7A, NM?

                          Am I asking too much?


                          Marco

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Do you need to remap after installing a different cam? I would imagine that to supply the cylinders properly you'd maybe need a higher fuel pressure? Does the ECU handle this, or would it be ok?

                            On a stage 1 ecu engine, are these 7as going to offer me much?

                            How much of a job is it to swap cams over?

                            Should I stop asking the same questions!
                            Ex S2 owner, now running around in an A4 Avant quattro...

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Yeah, I'd like to know this too. Is there any advantage on a stock engine with a 280hp chip (rated not true)? Will I be able to just bolt on the cam without a remap? Will the EX cam do or will it be better with both IN en EX cams?

                              Comment

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