Josh's ABY and v8 sedan(s?) projects:

[Josh-stateside]

Allrighty now.

So seeing as I feel like crap these days i've decided to roll the dice on a few ideas.

First off short story on how it began and why i've come to this Y in the road. Now quite a few years ago I picked up a pearl white coupe quattro here in the states. It didn't run at the time and we trailered it home. First dumb move by me is getting a pearl white car and second dumb move was the fact that it didn't run and needed lots of work. I'm now +-7 years older and still haven't ever been satisfied with the car. So I finally said fook it to myself and let it unravel itself. There are alot more reasons why I'm letting the coupe undo itself. However all of them = part out. I've got a registered 1994 audi 90 quattro. So that's my new project. I've had the v8 in it at one point and i've had the aby s2 engine in it at one point too. Both of them fit nicely in my opinion. Once you understand the problems and the simple solutions around them. The v8 fits just as good as the ABY S2 motor if not better here in the USA because u don't need something like the european front bumper. However there isn't much documentation about it and I like to keep things OEMish for the most part these days.

I've got some major decisions to decide in the next week or so and once i make my decisions i'll just have to live with them and see if i can make it work.

A couple of scenarios:

First one: I put the ABY S2 engine in the sedan for now and get it running and build up the v8 engine (mostly figured out).

The catch to the first one? I need to source a RS2 rieger bumper, or a s2 bumper. IF not, I need to be creative with things. I've got a rs2 fiberglass bumper but it's cracked and really shouldn't be on a car (that's another reason why my coupe never really made it to the road) I regret not getting a Real or rieger RS2 bumper big time. I've got an ABY lower rubber hose coming over to the states. I've got a silicone RS2 hose but it doesn't fit as well as I would of liked it to with the stock k24 turbo and ABY intercooler. All in all though i've got everything I need to get a S2 ABY engine running.

Basically i think i'd get the ABY running and then pull it and put it in another car or leave it in the car and sell it at some point in the near future.

The second scenario:

Well, I might consider buying another audi 90 quattro without an engine and put the S2 engine in it and sell it. I'm hopefully going to look at the car this weekend. I had the ABY S2 engine running at one point. I need to get a car running in the near future( I do have a truck for work and a three car garage/shop I rent). That's the plan. In the mean time i've been cleaning the garage and trying to sell as much parts that i don't need.

I don't need to get the silver sedan that I own completely finished but it be nice to get as much done as possible. Hypothetically I choose the v8 over the ABY S2 engine for many reasons. One of them is that it eliminates european parts for the most part in my opinion. I'd hate to get in a crash or small whatever and have to attempt to find parts that are not even located in the USA. V8 engines are plenty full here in the USA so i like that idea plus I spent the time to figure it out how to put it in a 90 and coupe quattro engine bay. What's nice about the 90 quattro is that because it was originally a v6 it's pretty much left alone. I'll probably even leave the battery in the stock location and ABS is somthing that stays vs the coupes in the usa where there would be alot of work to make ABS work with the v8.

I was going to run stock OEM engine management with the v8 but now i'm leaning towards VEMS.

So Within the next few months alot will be going on but not so much that i'm drained all the time. I know somethings up with me. It's a "******"? but i've got really no choice in the matter and I want to make the best of the situation. I need to get alot done by December. I really don't have the desire to freeze my buttock off this winter.

As far as me and progress with the sedan i might buy. I need to go check it out and see if it's a decent chassis. IF it is and I get it. The car will be forsale in the near future. Basically i'm leaving as much possible alone. It will be a 1994 or 5 i don't remember exactly right now audi 90 sedan with 4x108 bolt pattern, stock brakes, stock suspension, mostly stock exhaust etc. It will be up to the next owner to take it to where ever they want with the car.

I've been cleaning and sorting the shop the past few days and took a brief moment to start making a jig for engine mounts. I've got engine mounts in the sedan for the ABY S2 engine but I don't have them for a v8. I had engine mounts made from the stock v6 mounts to the block. I wish i did it the opposite but it's ok. At least they work.

This being said the mounts that work with the v8 will bolt on the frame rails like the v6 engine mounts. The reason why i'm making something like the 5 cylinder mounts is that i purchased ABZ engine mounts from O34 motorsports. I really am unhappy with them with the mounts and the time to get them. Then ontop of it having one completely welded wrong. So hopefully they're making me a new one like they promissed. I partly blame them for the demise of my coupe too. I had all this summer to work on things in the engine bay and i sent the stuff back to them in June, and still have yet to get any parts. My purchases with them in the future will be slim pickins now. The pilot bearing they sent me too was "******ed". So someone like mark swanson will benefit when i purchase something like vems for the v8 swap. I don't mean to rant about them and they're are good things about them. I'm just all set with anything built in house.

So..

Who knows, but i'll comment about how things are going here and there and if you have any questions as i post pictures etc feel free to ask anything. I'll do my best to explain why the choices i've made with everything.

Here is the start of the JIG, a picture of the sedan, and a pic of tired me.

[S2central.net]

Josh - you got a lot going on there buddy... I know what its like juggling the ongoing challenges of dreams vs reality and limited resources. Having more than two Audis at home is a disease that afflicts some of us more than others I suppose. The red 80V6Q runabout I bought for ~800 quid is going to cost me ball park another 50% of its value to get thru MOT - just in parts - ignoring my time, sweat and blood no doubt.

But to your dilemma - I think Opt 1 is best... A V8 engined CQ (4.2liter 40V version - yum) would be immense fun and actually I would love to do one someday - with aftermarket ECU like VEMS as you say to extract some more zip from what is probably a fairly conservatively tuned engine. Alongside that, an ABY engined B4 Sedan done properly gets you into rarified air of an S2 Sedan replica... The latter would be easily sold if you had to liquidate some of your efforts back into cash.

As to the bumper situation - have you got some feelers out with the right people on this side of the pond ? I realise that shipping is a major pain but thats life.

[Josh-stateside]

So I opted to not clean the shop today and do some car building instead. When you have alot of parts it's easy to make alot of progess. This isn't concrete and nothing is really together. It's just there for mock up purposes and to see what are the small details I have to figure out.

Oh yah, As far as me and buying another car. Screw it me thinks. I'll keep this car and build something around the v8 at some point in the future(really want to build a MkII golf quattro v8 track toy).

What your looking at?

Stock ABY S2 engine in a 1994 audi 90 quattro that had a v6 in it.

The stuff that's not stock:

Tilton proportional valve and AN braided lines to the 25mm master cylinder.
( I've got the b4 vacuum booster in there now but i'm swapping over to the b3 unit that I own because it's smaller and will give me some more clearance around the ABY high pressure power steering hose that i had to bend to fit around the booster)

Also If I had bought the Tilton with the 10mm fittings I could of used the hard lines. I however have the one with AN fittings so i decided to look in the parts bin and found a really quick solution. The braided lines are 12 inches long and have a banjo fitting on one end(on the master cylinder) and a regular fitting on the other end which connects to two more banjo fittings on the ABS module and tilton proportional valve.

The oil cooler in the front mounted above the intercooler is a BMW unit. I happen to have two of them. I've got an ABY oil cooler setup and I may use it as a secondary oil cooler. I still have to figure out the lines but for the most part I like it.

I happen to have a mocal thermostat and i need to look at things closely but i'm thinking I might use it ontop of the stock oil cooler thermostat. Basically i'm thinking of something along the lines of either running the BMW oil cooler off the stock thermostat and fittings and the stock oil cooler off the mocal unit or vice versa. The BMW oil cooler has the same size fittings as the audi stock stuff btw.

Also I think I might run the v6 power steering cooler and leave the stock fluted ( is that the word?) power steering cooler. The v6 power steering cooler fits with a small grind to the cross member. Basically the plumbing would go from the rack to the v6 cooler to a magnefine power steering filter back to the power steering tank, and then stock routing(at least that's what i'm thinking right now). Cheap, OEM, light, and easy. What's wrong with that?

A small note to add. I've got a RS2/ABY S2 fan and shroud. Luckly it clears the stock v6 engine mount that bolts to the frame rail. The coupe quattro shroud will not clear the engine mount and would need to be trimmed quite a bit.

As far as the fan resistor. KISS philosohy on that idea. I got an aluminum spacer that I had and mounted it to the v6 old battery ground( I didn't figure that out on my first attempts but got annoyed with the lack of brackets that I owned and then realized simplicity was in front of me).

What else? That little rear shelf on the back left corner of the engine bay is where i'm mounting the postive and ground feeds for jumping the car if necessary.

Other small stuff? Hmmm the lower coolant hose is from an audi 4000 and the thermostat is also from a 4000. The power steering pump is a v6 stock unit.

So im spent and have a long day tomorrow at work and then back to the garage to figure out more stuff.

Here are the pics:

[Josh-stateside]

more pics:

[panzerwagen]

Hi Josh, it's Marc....How are you feeling?

I've been keeping an eye on your progress and your posts on Motorgeek and I'm a bit alarmed at the loss of drive in you. It's as most of your zest has been lost. You got me worried fella. Is there something wrong?
I'm a bit older than you & have seen too many things in my life that would crush others but I've learned 1 important thing, and especially with my dear Mom passing from Colon Rectal Cancer is that as long as you breathe, you live each day as if it's your last. You make the most of what you have and go on. Take it easy and enjoy Josh.
"The days ahead of us are shorter than the ones behind us, make the most of the ones ahead".

[Josh-stateside]

I've been keeping an eye on your progress and your posts on Motorgeek and I'm a bit alarmed at the loss of drive in you. It's as most of your zest has been lost. You got me worried fella. Is there something wrong?
I'm a bit older than you & have seen too many things in my life that would crush others but I've learned 1 important thing, and especially with my dear Mom passing from Colon Rectal Cancer is that as long as you breathe, you live each day as if it's your last. You make the most of what you have and go on. Take it easy and enjoy Josh.
"The days ahead of us are shorter than the ones behind us, make the most of the ones ahead".

There is alot going on in my life. But the coupe has to go these days. I just can't care like i cared anymore. There is too much out there that i've still haven't done yet and i'd rather be married to a house right now then a car. It is what it is i could make a list of things I don't have to worry about now not having a coupe as a project. It would be about 5 pages more than with the sedan. I use to have the patience for this but i'm loosing it. It's all good. As far as mom stuff is concerned it's way back when and i've been over it for a bit. She use to have a 90's quattro sedan anyways. Maybe it's meant to be that way.

Honestly.. the best moves in my car hobby i'm going to make in the next few months. Then the next best moves in my life right after that but for now I just need to save up the energy and push for a bit. I'm pretty positive i've got some form lead poisoning. It's my fault for the most part i was just dumb and other people don't care. Probably alot of them new about it and just didn't bother to tell me. At some point I get it check out but from quite a few years ago to now i would of never expected my body to ache like it does with things.

No worries.. car project first then house projects. I do houses for a living. It's time I get my *** in gear and make use of the talents in my life. Right now, quickly, and take advantage of this economy.

[Josh-stateside]

So i've been working non stop on the sedan. I've got a decent plan and it keeps growing and changing but i like everthing i've got planned so far in my head.

First off I'm keeping the ABY S2 spec engine. It's probably going to go through some stages of developement but I like what i've been thinking about so far in my head.

It's a complete reverse turn of direction that i've been planning for a long time but maybe a little time and whatever has cleared my mind.

The v8 engine I have will go in a 1993+ audi 90 v6 at some point in the near future. I'm still tempted to go buy that other 90 sedan but before I overwelm myself I'm going to get the 20vT running first in the sedan.

(I have a hard time reading paragraphs so hopefully everyone can read this stuff that i type)

What I got done the past few days:

Battery is relocated to the trunk, and 2 gauge welding cable has been put in with a circuit breaker and a few different point in the car specifically under the rear seat and at the firewall where the cable has lugs and connectors.

Taking out the driver seat took me a few hours. First off the battery was dead and I couldn't get the seat to move backwards and then the retards at the factory put allen head bolts with blue locktite on it. God it was so annoying and then the welded nut broke loose so I had to cut the nut off and now i've got to rivet nut in a thread setup next to the the original hole.

I worked on the brake setup in my head a bit. I won't bother with details too much but before I finish it I'm going to probably add a gauge and add AN fittings to the top three ABS ports too and convert the stock lines to 37 degree flares.

I looked at the b3 booster a bit closely and fitted it in the car. I don't have the appropriate bracket to mount it to the firewall but it definately helps vs the b4 booster. It gives me more room around the ABY high pressure hose that I had to bend to fit around the booster.

I worked on the v6 power steering cooler and that was pretty easy. I need to make a few decision about if I'm going to buy a new return hose or not, and where to place the magnefine filter but all in all it looks like a decent setup.

I'm probably going to ditch the afterun pump and the hoses to free up some space in the engine bay. I just need to decide if I'm going to do that before I get it running or after. For now i've got an acetal 90 degree fitting in it's place to delete the pump.

Also I'm not 100% positive i'm going to do this yet but i think I'm going to install a fumuto valve in the stock placement on the radiator of the fan switch and move the fan switch to the lower radiator hose via a connector with the appropriate threads that I got from a saab 900. I kinda like the idea.

Also I ordered a radio delete plate part # 1h0857231A It's got a small vw logo on it but i'm debating a few things again. I've got a nice sound system from the coupe to put in the sedan but I can't be bothered to do it again (luckly I made it modular via delphi engine connectors). So for now since the radio was busted on the sedan i'm going to stick the plate on the car. I think it will look nice.

What else?

I'm probably going to ditch the digital climate control setup in favor of the knob and cable setup. I'll wait to see if the digital climate control setup sells first. I like things as simple as possible. Manual controlled heat just seems to fit my personality a bit better these days. Anyone who's in the states and interested in my setup feel free to PM me with an offer.


As far as me and stages are concerned. First off attempt to get in on the road within a reasonable time. To me that's no more than 2 months from now. The sooner the better. Then as things work out I plan on a few upgrades. I want the engine bay to be as friendly as possible. Basically I hope to sell my ABY parts as a kit.

It would include: Intake manifold, throttle cable, cross over pipe and brackets, upper hose, crossmember, intercooler, lower hose, coolant hose setup and afterun pump and bracket, and crank breather setup.


This car is going to be my track toy and my only track toy. I know where I want it to go in future as far as upgrades it's just a matter of choosing when is the best time to do them and how into it I want to go with all of it. I don't want anything to crazy. I prefer the OEMish look of things and hopefully it will be a nice mix match of audi reliable parts and after market upgrades.

Whatever the case may be i'm making progress and it feels nice.

[Josh-stateside]

So i've worked on a few things here and there.

To start off a company I actualy like sent me the wrong battery lug covers. They're backwards and i'm annoyed cause i've had them for awhile and didn't open the package till now. I need to see if I can return them still. The battery box is from a boat company. I had it in the trunk of my coupe between the tank and the rear so i reused it in the sedan. The circuit breaker will be bolted to the top once I get the proper tap. For now I just stuck some weld studs through the back and it holds it in place. The battery box will be rivet nuted to the frame rail. I was lazy and haven't done it yet and I need to make sure I can get metric bolts with tapered heads at my local nuts and bolts supply store.

I also worked on the sound system stuff in the trunk. The box is from and audi A4. Basically i'm using now as a small storage container but it held a 6disc cd changer when i pulled it out of the car. Basically bolted right in after a few rivet nuts.

I'm still designing the amp rack. It's made from a front stress bar and a front snub bracket. Both items were basically cut in half and turned into mounting legs/posts. I'm not sure how i'm going to finalize the whole idea so I took a break from it.

I also installed the cargo net stuff that i got from the same A4. Same deal again with the rivet nuts. I also got a new OEM cargo net for $25.00 shipped on ebay. Who knows It might be a nice setup to have in the trunk. I just need to decide if I'm going to get an A4 rear carpet hopefully in the matching black or modify my stock carpet. The a4 carpet is slightly different. I would of taken the one from the junkyard but i opted to wait because I wasn't even sure the cargo net stuff would work.

I've been working on some other stuff but for now no pictures. I've got some ideas in my head. We'll see what happens.

[Josh-stateside]

The previous owner must of had someone install an aftermarket electric up and down antenna and radio and right before I took the car off the road it crapped itself. I ended up pulling the antenna a few days ago and had this big hole in the rear of the sedan. I was thinking of welding it up and adding the coupe quattro bee sting antenna to the roof of the sedan. I then realized I could rotate it 90 degrees and make it work on the rear. I need to oval out the hole so I can move it up a bit so it doesn't interfer with the body lines of the car but it looks factory to be honest. Also I'm going to get a stubby antenna because the only catch is that it kinda hits the OEM rear wing (which i'm debating about keep it or loosing it). I want a stubby antenna anyways. It looks more modern. Before I get to having the car painted I plan on doing some type of arch mods that blend in with the bumpers. I may stick it on the roof at some point and weld the hole up but to get it on the road and have a radio for a bit possibly at some point. I've got options now at least.

[Josh-stateside]

I almost forgot about the weather mats. This oem weather mat setup is from a 2002 Audi s4 my father owned that i gave the setup to him as a present years ago. What goes around comes around I guess and since we still have it I'm going to make it work in the sedan. The driver side works perfectly. I just need to move the alignment pins on the passenger side and consider adding some in the rear.

[S2central.net]

Nice and simple idea - I like it...

[Josh-stateside]

So I figured I do it right when it came to engine mounts. Now i've got a full time JIG. I'll probably go this weekend to the junk yard and do the same to a b4 audi 90 v6 quattro. Engine mounts that bolt in that work with a v8, and a 5 cylinder, and a 4 cylinder. It might happen soon enough.

[S2central.net]

I like your idea for adapting the V6 chassis with funky engine mounts to take the other engines - saves a lot of stress for anyone doing engine swaps - and means less cars get butchered with a plasma torch for the donation of their engine mounts. Great idea Josh !

[Josh-stateside]

Well it's "sedans" now or "saloons" as you call them in the uk? I bought another one this weekend for $450.00USD. It will be very interesting how things play out but one gets a 20vT and one gets a v8. One of them I keep and one of them I sell. Hopefully both running by january 1st 2010. I'm still not feeling the greatest but i'm going to get some help with the builds so to speak to figure it out. I've got a decent game plan but I'm not necessarily sure of all the details yet.

On a good note the one i bought today is staying in CT for the next few weeks plus while the owner gets me the title. It gives me time to finish cleaning the shop and get the other sedan back together as much as possible. On a good note, I don't need the title for it come January 1st 2010 because the car would be 15 years old and in my state you just need a bill of sale and they make you a new title.

After this stuff is done, I'm done with cars for a while I hope. Hopefully alot of this: in either a 20vT or v8 but I don't care honestly which one ends up my toy. I will tell you it's very nice to know I have about 98% of both figured out and alot of the parts to finish them. So things should progress quite quickly.


I hope I made the right move but worse case scenario I've got a parts car to sell parts off all this winter.

Cheers
Josh

[Josh-stateside]

Some pics of random stuff i've been working on these days. The shopping cart is going to be my future welding cart once I modify it. Um, hmmmm... i snatched it today while selling some car parts at a mall where i met up with someone.

I was never really a clean person but something took over me this past month and that's all I do is clean and organize now. As you can see here are some of the results.


Also a pic of the sedan I bought. Me likey very much for the price.