Andyg's Colgate Wagon Project thread

[k.alle]

I guess that's a question only you can answer in the end.

If you are eager and have the time and resources to build something more 'hairy' then by all means go for it.
Be aware it is a potential can of worms when you take that path, should be fun in the end though.

[andyg plym]

Exactly right do I do it now whilst it’s all in a thousand pieces? Saw a package on Facebook this week for a turbo (hx40?) manifold, screamer pipe etc for a thousand euros not bad I thought

[k.alle]

Would that small increase in bore really make such a difference power wise?
If your'e happy with the bolt on stuff I say keep it as is.

Although if you have uprated rods in combination with the new pistons you'll have the peace of mind of upping the power in the future if you choose to.

[andyg plym]

Update; machine shop attempted to hone but said there was a lip and I’m sure he said 4 thou of wear so now needs a rebore. So guessing now it will need oversize pistons etc etc

got to drop the crank off but have been advised that engine balancing shouldn’t be required

just deciding what route to take now as I was convinced at keeping it rs2+ spec but if displacement is going to be bigger should I look at more power? I like the OEM bolt on stuff too much I think

let the shopping commence, got some new ARP studs today for £123 so happy with that!

[andyg plym]

Just like the shells no marks, piston rings all identical in feel/ movement I was expecting number 4 to be different from the rest but no. Surprised how heavy the crankshaft was!

[SteveH]

Mains shells look ok. What are the big ends like?

[andyg plym]

Been busy today , all came apart really easily get it off to the machine shop shortly along with the head

[andyg plym]

Who are you using Andy?

Paul inch engine services Plymouth used to use him years ago when I was in the garage

[merlin's S4]

So I heard back from the engine shop earlier, he said it looked like water ingress which he’d seen many times, ties in with the head gasket being particularly bad on the same cylinder and it has misfired slightly (for a couple of seconds) on start up for a while which would no doubt be coolant in the bore putting the spark out.
He believes although it looks bad he can easily get it out and will also do the work on the head. He has a good UK supplier of all reinz/ erling gaskets etc
I have to say at the moment without tempting fate it’s all looking positive and won’t cost too much.... famous last words.
if it is new pistons and all that goes with it I’m really not bothered about more power rs2+ is just nice

Who are you using Andy?

[andyg plym]

So I heard back from the engine shop earlier, he said it looked like water ingress which he’d seen many times, ties in with the head gasket being particularly bad on the same cylinder and it has misfired slightly (for a couple of seconds) on start up for a while which would no doubt be coolant in the bore putting the spark out.
He believes although it looks bad he can easily get it out and will also do the work on the head. He has a good UK supplier of all reinz/ erling gaskets etc
I have to say at the moment without tempting fate it’s all looking positive and won’t cost too much.... famous last words.
if it is new pistons and all that goes with it I’m really not bothered about more power rs2+ is just nice

[SteveH]

Thanks for feedback guys, it’s not even on 80k miles but appreciate this may now be irrelevant. So worst case are we saying the block could be beyond repair ?

No mate! You just might need to get it rebored and get oversized pistons/rings and then get the crank assembly rebalanced.

[andyg plym]

Thanks for feedback guys, it’s not even on 80k miles but appreciate this may now be irrelevant. So worst case are we saying the block could be beyond repair ?

[twenty valve]

Initially I couldn’t get a nail in the marks , I tried brake cleaner on a cloth and wiped it, then wd40 but only a very light go. Now the marks feel grainy when you rub your fingers over them
still waiting for a response from the engine shop but I guess they could also be on lockdown, I did watch some amusing YouTube videos one guy using a drill at high speed with some sort of bore cleaner and loads of lube.... it didn’t really work so best left to the pros I think!

whats the going rate on a hone? anybody done similar?

you will need to get all those marks out, and it sounds like a simple hone won't cut it (no pun intended). There's only so much material you can remove before the clearance between bore and piston is too large. IIRC stock clearance is around 0.0030" to 0.0035" (0.076 - 0.09 mm) but don't quote me on that. I would say you can push it a thou over this, but any more and you will likely suffer with piston slap, poor ring seal, excessive oil consumption etc etc. Depending on mileage, tune, and how well the engine has been looked after, you might already have exceed these tolerances just through wear. That leaves no room for even a light hone. Leave alone trying to hone out damage.

The video you saw was probably either a spring loaded hone tool or a flexi hone. These have their place and can be used with good effect. But typically the application is when you are just trying to deglaze a bore which is in otherwise good condition. This restores a fresh cross hatch pattern to enable new rings to bed in properly.

SteveH I would second the comment about getting the head checked out properly. These old heads can suffer badly with porosity. Again this depends on how well its been looked after (whether its always had good corrosion inhibiter/antifreeze and hasn't been left standing with old coolant). You definitely don't want to rebuild it and have the same problem come back.

And yeah you could balance up the new piston to match the old. Even though it's larger, it could actually be lighter than the original due to more modern alloys and design. But honestly it's not that serious.

[SteveH]

No worries not ignorant at all. Depending upon the change in piston weight, then technically yes it might do. But i would argue in any case, it would be negligible and wouldn't cause any detriment or noticable difference. In this scenario I definitely wouldn't worry about it. In other circumstances then sure you might wan't to consider getting a rebalance.

andyg plym That's interesting. Perhaps it's not as bad as it looks in the pictures. Keep us posted with what the engine shop say

I guess fitting one oversized piston isn't recommended, but if you were to do this and ensure the new piston weighed the same as the old one, then the engine balance shouldn't be too bad. You can remove weight from the underside of the piston to even the weights up.

[SteveH]

You're looking at £50-£100 for honing depending on where you take it. One possibility if it is water damage is that you have some porosity in the head and the water has come into the cylinder via an inlet or exhaust port. If the related valve is open when the engine switches off, the water can leak down the port and enter the cylinder. I had this on a 3B head and had to get it welded and ultrasealed - http://ultrasealslough.co.uk/

If you are rebuilding the head, check all the ports and it will be easy to see if you have coolant which has been making its way through the casting.