Pictures of brake upgrades

[anton]

Not quite what your going to expect but i'm trying to find some side-on pictures of brake upgrades, front and rear, would like to be able to fit the balljoint extenders mentioned in another thread, also dont want issues with the calipers fouling the wheel spokes as i want to see how much clearance i need for different wheel designs. wanting pics like this basically:


looking mostly at the 996/323 fronts and 300/s4 rears but all others also welcome

Cheers
Ant

[anton]

actually just read back thru the s4 rear brake upgrade and that moves the disc 5mm outbourd, so any pics of the standers stuff you have them would be great too
also as for the fronts i really just want to know if they move out or in at all. i remember seeing a pic of the standard and a8 discs flat on a table, cant find them though if anybody can remember or point me in the right direction??

Ant

[s2driveruk]

sorry Ant, what's the big advantage on the extended balljoints....didn't find the thread where this was discussed?
Cheers
David

[Acidburn]

actually just read back thru the s4 rear brake upgrade and that moves the disc 5mm outbourd, so any pics of the standers stuff you have them would be great too
also as for the fronts i really just want to know if they move out or in at all. i remember seeing a pic of the standard and a8 discs flat on a table, cant find them though if anybody can remember or point me in the right direction??

Ant

Check terrybullwon's thread and there was one by s2central showing the depth (think it was his rear brake thread)

sorry Ant, what's the big advantage on the extended balljoints....didn't find the thread where this was discussed?
Cheers
David

It increases the castor or something iirc, stiglett was talking about them.

[Rusty]

I think it's camber, not castor. Something to do with maintaining correct camber when the suspension is loaded up under cornering.

Castor is the angle of the strut viewed from the side, adjusted off topmounts or subframe bushes.

Looking at that pic the extensions are to keep the wishbone in the OE location when the car is lowered. This will also mean that ARB operation is as per OE as it's in the stock position.

[Acidburn]

Your be closer than my guess then, I have not looked into stuff like this for mine, atm my main concern was getting it inside the lockup out of the bad weather which is completed now

[anton]

like Andy said they maintain the stock camber compensation (as in then you roll the wheels need to change angle) as it is, those of us with lowered cars get posotive camber at the front, IMHO thats where 50% of the understeer at the limmit comes from. looks like the rears are not a problem, assuming the stock location works, but i can check that. mainly concerned about the front but from the pics i have found it looks like the total height of the a8 discs is identical to the stock one??

Ant

P.S. David here is the extender thread:clicky

[Flat on my back]

Hmmmmm...

Hope he/she checked the brake caliper after that shot...that disc wear is way too uneven...

[Rusty]

I guess that the extenders work by adjusting the working arc of the wishbones then?

Mounting the ball joints higher would have the same effect. Not convinced by the safety of the extender but I'm just cautious after some near bad experiences with the S2.

[s2driveruk]

I guess that the extenders work by adjusting the working arc of the wishbones then?

Mounting the ball joints higher would have the same effect. Not convinced by the safety of the extender but I'm just cautious after some near bad experiences with the S2.

got to say i agree with you on that, not sure i like the idea of two pinch bolts really in such a short space but also am struggling to really see the benefits as in real world ones i mean, technically I get the drift. I'm thinking that I'll only upgrade stuff where i can associate the cost to an increase in speed, stability or breaking....so far the car seems to be ok for me as is regards camber...

[Rusty]

It's worthwhile alright, assuming the geometry goes to pot when you lower it. It's already lowered from stock don't forget so is >2" from stock position at the LBJ. If the wishbones are already pointing upwards quite a bit then the horizontal component of the wishbone is going to drop at a greater rate than intended and thus put the camber out by more when cornering.

[Error404]

the extenders alter the height of the roll centre. the amount of body roll is affected by the difference between the centre of gravity and the roll centre. When you lower a car you often bring the CoG and roll centre "closer together" so you acutally increase the cars body roll.. these try to reduce that.

EDIT Speeeling

[Rusty]

Yeah, I see. So what I'm describing as the angle of the wishbones actually dictates the roll centre. All good stuff. Some BS diagrams would help nail this... unless there's an old thread I've missed?

[stiglet]

In a nutshell, it's important to change the location of the pivot, not the wishbone neccessarily. So the ball joint has to be lower in relation to the inner pickups. This is the best practical way to do that, not ideal though I agree. This in turn raises the roll centre.

The benefit is two fold; less roll and more camber on roll, static camber should be the same. I believe that as standard the Coupes are designed to understeer through positive camber on roll, same as Golfs, as well as the ARBs. I.E. when you go into a corner, the rears gain camber giving you grip but the fronts don't nearly enough which leads to understeer in a very progressive fashion (easy to control for your everyday driver). This effect is even worse on cars that have been lowered. Even though bigger ARB's should lessen the problem, they won't eliminate it completely.

That's the theory anyway. They guy is in the process of making a batch now, so i'll find out soon enough what happens. Should be an interesting little experiment anyway

[stiglet]

Sorry Alex, didn't see your reply before i replied. You have it spot on, but the CofG and RC are further apart when you lower.