My tilton proportioning valve setup:

[Josh-stateside]

Not much to say but designing it and figuring out how to make it fit nicely was a pita. The whole car has been swapped over to AN fittings so I made all my own lines out of cunifer with stainless ferules and nuts. The tubing was single 37 degree flared. It's safe to do so on cunifer. The hiccup is that i had to loose the stock cigerette (fag?i remember that from trainspotting) lighter spot. I'll be moving to in front of the rear ashtray. I don't have alot of pictures but here are a few:

[Josh-stateside]

i figured i'd post this for reference. I happen to have a flexible ruler from my art background. It came in handy for gauging an idea of the length of the tubes.

[s2driveruk]

liking that alot look fwd to finding how it alters the braking once its back on the road

[Dirtylouie]

Hi Josh! Is it convenient to use it in that slot? easy reachable & shifts all 7 positions? Why did you decide to use cooper pipes and not googridge armored hose? any specific reason? Whats up with diff lock switch now?

[Josh-stateside]

Hi Josh! Is it convenient to use it in that slot? easy reachable & shifts all 7 positions? Why did you decide to use cooper pipes and not googridge armored hose? any specific reason? Whats up with diff lock switch now?

Yes I like the convience of the idea and the fact that now i don't have to go under the car on jackstands to make hard lines. It was quite nice making lines inside a car vs outside and under and on my back and ***** falling on my face et. It was worth all the head scratching to me at least.



At some point I'm putting a v8 rear diff in the car so there is no more switch to activate it. It's a torsen rear diff. As far as why I used cunifer. I'm not the biggest fan of braided lines but I had goodridge lines in there to start with but that design was slightly different. There are braided lines in the rear of car from the bulkhead fittings under the rear seat to the calipers. There are 10mm to -3an steel adapters on the rear calipers. I feel alot more comfortable with hardlines inside the car than braided. I would hate to get burned by brake fluid if something let go while i was on the track. There will be a full interior in the car and that's the other reason why i went with cunifer. I may be blind now to the lines but at least know they're solid lines.

It's really late like 4am ish. I got the day off and couldn't sleep much but i'm forget stuff here and there. I started this whole idea using braided lines and banjo fittings for clearance but once i realized i could make the hard lines work i opted to do it. Making hard lines isn't too easy. I've got a collection of tools now to say the least.
What nice about the cunifer is that i basically bent it by hand. I used a spring tube bender just to be on the safe side but for the most part i never touched any typical tube benders.

[Dirtylouie]

Josh, thanks a lot for your quick reply, as a matter of fact i am in the process of installing same mods, except a plan to use the car for some stunts also, this is why hydraulic HB is also coming in. My final decision was also to use copper lines inside the car (and for the same reasons i must confess ) One thing which i doubt now - mine also has spoons installed instead of original seats. and i have found that with shoulder support it is not convenient to use handbrake in it's original position, therfore i am thinking of mmoving both tilton and hb further from their original positions. that is another story as the car has to remain with the interior (mostly ) anyway, thx for this tread, once i'm back to thae garage i will tru to consider your configuration for tilton, as mine already has V8 diff fitted Just need to look for all these plastic plastic covers now

[S2central.net]

@Josh - you HAVE deleted the factory fitted regulator - RIGHT ?

[Josh-stateside]

@Josh - you HAVE deleted the factory fitted regulator - RIGHT ?

Yes and abs. There is no more ES2(aby s2 engine) in my coupe. It's a ABZ v8 swap now so i have vacuum assist brakes as well. I know i lost the stock proportioning valve safety setup. If people are not aware of it. If pressure is lost in the front brakes it sends full front and rear to the rears.

[Dirtylouie]

Yes and abs. There is no more ES2(aby s2 engine) in my coupe. It's a ABZ v8 swap now so i have vacuum assist brakes as well. I know i lost the stock proportioning valve safety setup. If people are not aware of it. If pressure is lost in the front brakes it sends full front and rear to the rears.

Josh, could you please share some more details of hydraulics for vacuum swap: which parts did you use, how expensive/complicated was it to get those? i've got 3B, does it make any difference with ABY brake system? AFAIK i won't have to get rid of ABS when using proportioning valve, as i have one line going to rear wheels, correct me if i'm wrong, so called 3-channel ABS.

[Josh-stateside]

Josh, could you please share some more details of hydraulics for vacuum swap: which parts did you use, how expensive/complicated was it to get those? i've got 3B, does it make any difference with ABY brake system? AFAIK i won't have to get rid of ABS when using proportioning valve, as i have one line going to rear wheels, correct me if i'm wrong, so called 3-channel ABS.

There are a few things I can mention. First I'll start off with the factory proportioning valve. It's designed so that if the front's were to fail it would send full front and rear pressure to the rears. I like that idea alot but in the end i decided i'll deal with not having that safety feature. Hopefully just big brakes and the e-brake in the rear would be enough in some crazy situation. As far as swaping over to vacuum brakes. Starting off with the 5 cylinder power steering/brake assist pump a direct swap to replace it to be just a power steering pump is a unit from either the ABZ audi v8 or the 12v audi 2.8L and probably 2.6L too. It fits directly in the stock location. A return line from the rack to the power steering reservoir could be something like from that same car or be custom made for your application. Just make sure the feed from the reservoir to the power steering pump is at least 5/8" of an inch inside diameter. I run a 3/8"9(10mm) line from the return on the rack to a magnetic filter over to a power steering cooler, and then back to the reservoir. From there it feeds directly to the power steering pump. As far as vacuum assist brakes I've got a new Audi 80 brake booster (pre 1991ish i thinks) mounted on the stock coupe quattro hydraulic assisted bracket. Now the reason why I'm doing this is because the audi 80 bracket is longer but the driver side of the v8 block is very close to the master cylinder. If I didn't use the coupe quattro bracket I would have to tilt the master cylinder bracket up to clear the rear of the head and the breather port. Now the 1993+ish (at least in the states) brake booster is different than the earlier unit. It's larger and it uses the same size bracket as the coupe quattro hydraulic assist setup. Actually to be honest. I've got my ABY S2 engine in a 1993 audi 90 quattro now and thats the setup i'm using for brakes. IF one were to use the earlier booster and the coupe quattro stock bracket there will not be enough clearance for the engine harness (at least in a left handed sided driver location. Make somewhat sense? Also I think you need the rod from the brake booster too that connects to the brake pedal. The stock coupe quattro unit is smaller.

The only thing i need to check is the booster rod length and connection with the brake pedal. Which i don't think will be a problem and doesn't have anything to do with anyone with a 5 cylinder engine setup. With my current setup on the v8 it's not stock enough but i looked at it quickly and looked like it would be fine. It's really a BIG pita to put the Tilton where i have it currently located. If I didn't remove abs, if i didn't swap over to vacuum brakes, and if i didn't gut so much of the car and have alot of time to figure it out there is no way i would of done it. But i've got some time and a decent size garage to figure it out and make it work properly. There are alot of positives about it. However I don't necessarily recommend it to most people.

There are some decent expensive tools needed for hard lines if your going to do a 37 degree flare ( I did this because there isn't any like bulkhead fittings in metric bubble flare) .

I bought a imperial 37 degree flare tool which is a heavy duty unit which cost +- $90.00. It works "ok". I did some reading and i will purchase a parker rolo-flare at some point in the near future. The aviation guys seems to prefer the parker vs the imperial. I bought a few Tube reamers. One was a T-handle unit and another was an inner-outer reamer. The inner outer reamer didn't do the insides of the 3/16" hardline very well so that's why i bought a t-handle unit.

Also the loop clamps are 3/16" vinyl units and i installed them to the transmission tunnel via 6mm rivet nuts. I've got individual rivet nut tools for 6,8, and 10mms. They're around $40.00 each.

If you do the math putting a proportioning valve in the stock location is alot cheaper and easier.

I'm just being honest here but if anyone were to ever attempt it as one can see it can be done.

[Dirtylouie]

Josh, Hi, thx a lot, will be considering your comments when finally get back to vacuum swap issue. afraid more questions will follow then.

best regards,
Mike

[anton]

you say the stoc kbias valve can cut off the supply to the fronts if they fail?? when my front brake line broke on my CQ i lost all brakes and had to use the handbrake, acording to family album all models have the same valves only the unit changed in 92 so i guess its only the ABYs that have this system
what harm would come from removing the stock bias from my CQ for this unit?? does the stock have more than 1 step perhaps???

Ant

[Josh-stateside]

you say the stoc kbias valve can cut off the supply to the fronts if they fail?? when my front brake line broke on my CQ i lost all brakes and had to use the handbrake, acording to family album all models have the same valves only the unit changed in 92 so i guess its only the ABYs that have this system
what harm would come from removing the stock bias from my CQ for this unit?? does the stock have more than 1 step perhaps???

Ant

All the stock proportioning valves are meant to work this way. Basically if one of the front lines go it's sappose to send the front pressure to the rears. You'll loose alot of the breaking ability and probably will end up having to use the e-brake on top of everything. The leak isn't going to stop, but the pressure difference in the front brakes will be noticed by the stock proportioning valve and it will send what's left of the fronts to the rears. Is it ok to ditch it? That's a personal preference in my opinion.

[Dirtylouie]

All the stock proportioning valves are meant to work this way. Basically if one of the front lines go it's sappose to send the front pressure to the rears. You'll loose alot of the breaking ability and probably will end up having to use the e-brake on top of everything. The leak isn't going to stop, but the pressure difference in the front brakes will be noticed by the stock proportioning valve and it will send what's left of the fronts to the rears. Is it ok to ditch it? That's a personal preference in my opinion.

Hmm.. never heard of this function of a proportioning valve. afaik it's a pretty simple device, meant to reduce the square of the rear line opening in case of hard breaking in the corner to avoid rear axle overbreaking. I have just installed both tilton and wilwood hydraulic HB. Works fine with factory valve in place.

[Josh-stateside]

Hmm.. never heard of this function of a proportioning valve. afaik it's a pretty simple device, meant to reduce the square of the rear line opening in case of hard breaking in the corner to avoid rear axle overbreaking. I have just installed both tilton and wilwood hydraulic HB. Works fine with factory valve in place.

all the audi units that are on our cars i should have said. There is a pdf file somewhere around if i remember correctly from the URQuattro setup. If I remember where it is located i'll post it.