Engine balancing in UK

[Ross]

Hi,

Had a chat with Tom a while back, he mentioned there's a place in Swindon that has experience balancing 5cyl. motors. I plan on getting this done when the rods, bearings + head gasket are fitted. Just wondering if anyone has suggestions of where to contact for quotes etc, and how long the job takes?

Also - once this stuff is fitted, do I need to take it easy on the engine for xxx miles? Or is it OK to get it mapped right away?

I was looking at May, but you know how it goes; didn't anticipate a few of the extra's that have been added to the project so I may have to delay a few months to avoid racking up the credit card for this one. But I'd like to get an idea logistally of what the job entails, so I don't have any surprises!

Any info regarding balancing shops, prices, appreciated! Is it just a 'crack rebalance' i need to enquire about?

[S2central.net]

Few quick points -

Bassett Down come highly recommended. I honestly don't know of any other place that I would send beloved engine internals for such work.

Would advise against going straight into full WOT remapping with a freshly built engine. Wiser to break it in a little more gently so you give things a while to settle in with gradual progression to full on antics. Don't have any metrics on how many miles for this - maybe 1k or so for fresh crank bearings.

I wouldn't worry too much about how long the work takes - an extra day or two is neither here or there. You don't want that work rushed.

FInally - renew the oil pump while the bottom end is out.

[Jon441cc]

Hi,

Had a chat with Tom a while back, he mentioned there's a place in Swindon that has experience balancing 5cyl. motors. I plan on getting this done when the rods, bearings + head gasket are fitted. Just wondering if anyone has suggestions of where to contact for quotes etc, and how long the job takes?

Also - once this stuff is fitted, do I need to take it easy on the engine for xxx miles? Or is it OK to get it mapped right away?

I was looking at May, but you know how it goes; didn't anticipate a few of the extra's that have been added to the project so I may have to delay a few months to avoid racking up the credit card for this one. But I'd like to get an idea logistally of what the job entails, so I don't have any surprises!

Any info regarding balancing shops, prices, appreciated! Is it just a 'crack rebalance' i need to enquire about?

If it’s of any interest to anybody i rang this guy this morning and had a good chat with him to sort out the myths from facts.

Q: When fitting aftermarket rods and pistons is a re-balance required?
A: Definitely.

Q: When changing out the flywheel and or the front vibration damper is a re-balance required?
A: You could get away with out but its not advised. Crank, Flywheel and Pulley are balanced as a complete unit in the I5's.

Q: What process is used to balance the entire assembly?
A: Pistons, Rings, Clips, Rods, are all balanced equal, and then bob weights are made to match weights. Crank, flywheel, and pulley are all bolted together with bob weights attached to each throw, entire assembly balanced. Then Clutch can be added on and the process is repeated.

Q: What do I need to send him for the job?
A: Everything. Complete pistons, rods, rings, shells, clips, Crank, flywheel, pulley, nuts and bolts, and bearing shells.

Q: What does it cost?
A: 120+carrage+vat

Still can’t believe how little it costs, defiantly one step I won’t be skipping on my build.

http://www.s2forum.com/forum/showthr...ighlight=crank

[S2central.net]

Yeah - forgot to add...

When sending stuff to BDB - make sure it is all carefully numbered and oriented so that there is no confusion about what shells and bolts belong to which piston and how that aligns to the crank itself.

Also for a little extra charge, you can have BDB 'blueprint' the pistons and conrods so that they are all the same weight. Maybe this is normal practice actually - I cannot remember - it is best to ask the experts.

[Ross]

Cheers, not sure how I missed that thread - glad to see BDB are in Swindon as that's not too far from me!! And prices aren't exactly astronomical. just gotta organise some transport for the engine now; and as per timing - I'll be planning on doing this within a week off work so a few days isn't a problem.

Hopfully, my project list won't grow too much more else this isn't gonna get done till well into summer! My "project list" encompasses most of my "wish list" now - the bill is gonna be quite scary...

[SteveH]

Yeah - forgot to add...

Also for a little extra charge, you can have BDB 'blueprint' the pistons and conrods so that they are all the same weight. Maybe this is normal practice actually - I cannot remember - it is best to ask the experts.

Phil at Bassett Down will ensure all the rods, pistons and bits are all identical in weight...He works to 0.5 gram tolerance. If changes are required he'll take the weight off the inside crown of the piston or the centre of the wrist pin. This is part of the basic balance, so there's no extra charge.

[S2central.net]

Cool - thx for clarifying that Steve... Its a black art that stuff - I wish I understood the mechanics of it all.

Something I used before when working with BDB was the homologation papers for the car which specified the minimum weights of crank, rods, pistons & flywheel for legal GpN use. That's the target I set them with and it was amazing to see how much had been removed from factory parts to get to GpN specs... Obviously these things are tweaked by the manufacturer before the FIA get their hands on sample parts.

The S2 homologation papers are now extremely hard to find. I'd like to see what weights were in the papers for the S2 internals as a good guide for safe weight targets.

Paul

[Ross]

Just to follow-up on this thread:

Crank, new rods & pistons, bearing shells, crank dampener, clutch, flywheel, all asociated bolts were supplied to BDB last week.

This afternoon, I have it all balanced and ready to to put back together! Very quick and very helpful service from Philip! Looking forward to an uber-smooth engine

[aelred]

Just to add to this there is a further balancing place in Swindon near J 15 on the M4, if one is too busy I use the other. This one will take weight of the crank as he has full machine facilities

[Jamo]

Just to add to this there is a further balancing place in Swindon near J 15 on the M4, if one is too busy I use the other. This one will take weight of the crank as he has full machine facilities

Out of curiousity what is the name of this place?

[Flat on my back]

Just found this place...

http://www.andrewsprecision.co.uk/

Local to me so might go visit.

[Pembo]

About to start on my bottom end rebuild and will be using Impulse Developments in Rochdale (www.impulsedevelopments.co.uk 01706 650800 Adrian) who are known for competition engine tuning. Had my head done here and they made an A1 job.
I'll keep you informed of progress including block relining.
PS Anyone have 1 or a set of standard 80.98mm pistons?

[Jamo]

Thing is guys unless they can proved they have balanced an I5 engine before walk away!

[Flat on my back]

Well...

you got some 'pointed' questions i should ask...

know what your saying saying for the 5's though...

[Jamo]

you got some 'pointed' questions i should ask...

know what your saying saying for the 5's though...

Light reading http://www.s2forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12552

The 5 cylinder engine is difficult to balance and there are only very few people that can do this. The crank, front pulley and flywheel are balanced together, 50% of the weight of the piston with rings, bearings and rods are added to the crank. If i had an engine fully balanced I would not change any of the balanced components in order to loose some weight. I have lightned flywheels by a lot and I will be honest the last one was miles out in respect of balancing I think it was 30 if not 50 grms, (this was not the original flywheel and proves the point) you should have seen the crank with pulley balanced trying to jump out of the balancing bed and that was only at 600rpm.

The five cylinder engine is balanced using a 50% factor, that is what Audi recommend is best for the multiplane crank. If the engine was balanced to a 0% factor life will be simpler as you could have all parts individully balanced (like on a single plane crank)therefore if you change items like the front pulley as long as it was balanced to a 0% factor it would not matter.