Hesitation under acceleration S6 AAN

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  • smogthemog
    S2Forum Enthusiast
    • Oct 2006
    • 149
    • Home: United Kingdom Current: England

    #1

    Hesitation under acceleration S6 AAN

    I thought I would share this with you all after posting my findings on the Audifans forum. After a few people coming back with possible plug and coil pack problems I eventually found out what the problem was with the car:-

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    My car has always seemed to have done this since I have had it - You floor it and after the lag it seems to surge on power a bit. Sometimes during acceleration it GLF! but it hesitates during this. It's now't too bad but it's certainly noticable.

    Problem is, unless you have driven someone elses same car it's difficult to accertain what to expect from yours?
    Maybe the car is down on power overall - maybe it fly's..... I just don't really know what to expect.

    I had the F5DPOR's (plugs) out the other day (Now fitted some new ones - ED) and they are starting to get a little worn on the center electrode, it was certainly more than 0.6mm - more like 1mm!!
    I tried to close them all up a little and seemed to succeed (didn't have a feeler guage at the time but it looked better than they where before I started). It didn't make much difference to the surging mind so I ordered a set of NGK Iridium plugs to see how they fair. If they are no good then a new set of Boscho's will have to be saught

    Any ideas of what else could be causing this problem ?

    ----------------------------------------------------------------

    I think I may have found out as to what may be causing my hesitation problem.
    I stripped down the air box tonight and found the following pipework (pic's below) connecting the cone filter to the MAF. The added piping is a considerably smaller bore than the bore diameter of the MAF plus there is a short connecting bend within the pipework that is even smaller and obviously air restrictive!
    I will be taking a look at it tomorrow (Sat) to see what I can do to alleviate this problem?

    Jim







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    Well well well - I problem has been cured.

    The pipes leading to the aftermarket air filter where indeed too darn small!!!
    Upon measuring these pipes against the bore diameter of the MAF the MAF turned out to be 70mm and the added pipes where 55mm :evil:

    Whoever fitted this modification want stringing up by the danglies and poking with a sharp stick !

    I removed the complete original air box, the Apexi air filter was mounted inside it, and after a bit of stainless steel bracketary and a heat shield to keep the extreme heat from the turbo away from the intake, I mounted the filter right inline with the MAF as you can see in the below phoggies.

    I also re-directed the cold air flow pipe, that comes from the front of the car, onto the new filter thus keeping away any heated air from the engine bay.

    OMFG!!! what a difference this has made. The car is now SO much more powerful and SO smooth through the rev range.

    Only problem with fitting the filter open like this and not in an air box is that the Recirc valve is now VERY noisy under operation (the Harry Halford, boy town racer DV whoosh noise) which I don't really like!



    Found this orrible bit of steel pipe (another bloody restriction) shoved in the rubber pipe joining the MAF to the turbo inducer. It's now removed!









    Jim B
    97 S6 AAN Quattro Avant C4 | Powerflow Cat Back EX | Milltek Hyperboost RV | MAC N75 Valve | FMIC | HID's (Dip & Fog's)| MRC Re-map SII | Carbon interior | De-chromed | Short shift | Samco Air Hoses |

    http://smogthemog.blogspot.com/
  • UrS4boy
    S2Forum Obsessed
    • Feb 2006
    • 11859
    • Country: Canada

    #2
    That's great you found the source of your missing/hesitation problems. Usually the issue is a plug, plug connector, POS or Coil. I have never heard of an air flow problem causing the problem. This probably because most people do NOT neck down the pipes/hoses to the MAF like your car's previous owner did.

    But, after reviewing your excellent quality photos, I am perplexed: What is the fascination with cone filters? Yours looks like it has less gross surface area than the original panel filter. Your "heat shield" is a token effort and is about as good as applying sun-block SPF5 to the cone filter, i.e. very little benefit. Running a fresh air pipe to cone is a good idea. Too bad the factory did that with the OE flat panel air box which, for reasons not clear to me, people think is c**p. (It isn't).

    Oh, yes, did you know the MAF is supposed to have screens both on the inlet and outlet to a) protect the hot wire and b) straighten out the flow to the hot wire?

    Sorry but you posted the pictures and, once seen, I had to comment.
    RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
    94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

    Comment

    • AndyP
      S2Forum Zealot
      • Feb 2004
      • 6049
      • Country: England

      #3
      I agree, mine had a cone filter when I bought it and it was the first thing I ripped off when I got it home. The noise from the dump valve made me feel like a Barry Boy!!
      The car felt so much smoother and quicker when I re-fitted the air box.
      sigpic
      1991 Audi S2 3B - 2.5 Stroker engine
      1997 A6 2.5TDi quattro avant - C4
      1976 RD250E / 350LC cafe racer

      Comment

      • smogthemog
        S2Forum Enthusiast
        • Oct 2006
        • 149
        • Home: United Kingdom Current: England

        #4
        This is the state of the bottom of the air box after the previous owner went to town on it

        What a bleedin mess! - without filling in all the holes and fitting a new standard panel filter (which I ordered today) , I will not be able to see how it should run as standard.
        I will endeavour to do this next weekend but as for now, the improvments I have made today to the power of the car - I am a happy man!




        I have a few more plans up my sleeve to add to the air cooling system around the cone filter. I have thought about externally cladding the MAF with insulation material in an attempt to keep it cool and also adding further cool air pipes from the front of the vehicle. I have also toiled with the idea of extending the heat sheild, which at the moment is only there to stop heat radiation from damaging the plastics, to encase the turbo a little better in an attempt to keep the heat from the filter. Maybe a thin walled stainless tube around the whole filter being fed by the cool air pipe from the front of the car?

        I dunno - it needs work..... I know this
        Jim B
        97 S6 AAN Quattro Avant C4 | Powerflow Cat Back EX | Milltek Hyperboost RV | MAC N75 Valve | FMIC | HID's (Dip & Fog's)| MRC Re-map SII | Carbon interior | De-chromed | Short shift | Samco Air Hoses |

        http://smogthemog.blogspot.com/

        Comment

        • UrS4boy
          S2Forum Obsessed
          • Feb 2006
          • 11859
          • Country: Canada

          #5
          I remember when I turned my Jetta 2L 16V air box into Swiss cheese and ran a K&N panel filter. Nice noises. - But not really efficient sucking warm air instead of cool/cold air.

          There is a way with the C4 S4 to run an airduct (PVC plumbing pipe) from the OE airbox down to the oil cooler duct (right side "fog light" possition) and thereby get rid of "negative boost", i.e. pressure losses on the way to the MAF. The only down side to that mod, compared to the OE S4 duct from just below the top of the rad support, is you have to avoid going through puddles in case you scoop up water and "hydrolock" your engine (water is virtually incompressible) which causes it to break.

          But, given that's an mostly avoidable risk, I would go down that route waaaay before I'd do a cone filter, even with a proper heat shield.

          Google on Negative Boost to find out more.
          RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
          94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

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