A GT30R is not just a GT30R - understanding the GT30R range

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  • Jamo
    Retired OG Mod
    • Mar 2004
    • 21750
    • Country: United Kingdom

    #1

    A GT30R is not just a GT30R - understanding the GT30R range

    After being baffled by previous posts and turbology posts with differing compressor maps i've trawled the internet to try and clear up what a GT30R turbo is.

    This information I'm posting is a collection of information posted global on the internet and are direct quotes.

    A GT30R turbo actually refers a range of turbos.

    A GT30Rs uses three basic sizes of compressor wheel in the GT30R series , firstly 71.1mm GT35 family , secondly 76/76.2mm TO4S or GT37 families , thirdly 82mm GT40 family while all share the same 60mm turbine

    In summary 71mm, 76.2mm, and 82mm compressor wheels

    As Garrett has decided to name their turbos by turbine family (GT30) and compressor by major these turbo's are commly known as the 3071R, 3076R (aka GT30R!) & 3082R (aka 3040r) respectively.


    Firstly the GT30R + 71.1mm GT35 compressor:

    This gets called GT3071R and is sold by Garrett with the 56T compressor under CHRA or cartridge no 700177-23 . There are a couple of GT3071R "WG" or wastegated turbos around but they are inferior because of the ground down to 56.6mm turbine is fitted in bored out *******ised GT28 turbine housings .
    HKS call theirs the GT2835 series and nearly always do better because of properly developed turbine housings - except those using the GT28 housing designed for SR20's .

    Secondly the GT30R + 76/76.2mm TO4S compressors . Regardless of what people tell you these 7/14 blade compressors are old technology , the 6/12 blade GT family wheels kill them from a spool and pumping efficiency perspective . The S wheels are not high speed comp wheels and were designed to work with T4 turbines .

    The CHRA numbers that use these wheels are 700177-10/-11/-12/-13-15/-18 . The -13 CHRA looks like it uses a 60-1 (409535-1) compressor and while it moves some air for its size is not the be all by todays standards .

    The GT30R + 76.2mm GT37 compressors are very good things . Garrett Japan make them in 48 , 52 and 56 trims which are marketed by HKS as GT3037 48/52/56 . Garrett also market the 56 trim version which they often call "GT30R".

    Generally the only way to identify any GT BB cartridge is to look at the ID tag's CHRA number which for GT30BB will be 700177 series . For these what I call propper or real GT30R's the CHRA numbers for 56 trim is 700177-7 , for the 52 trim is 700177-6 . I'm reasonably sure the 48 trim version is the 700177-5 , its not common though now I believe available through HKS for the Subaru WRX.

    The Garrett catalog shows the real GT30R 56T as unit no 700382-12 without turbine housing but you get to option one of three available turbine housing kits.

    The GT30R + 82mm GT40 compressor .

    These are usually called GT3040R or more recently GT3082R because Garrett has decided to name their turbos by turbine family (GT30) and compressor by major diametre (82mm) . The "R" means rolling element (read annular contact) ball bearing centre section.

    Both Garrett and HKS market slightly different versions of the GT3082R .
    Firstly HKS's version uses a 50 trim GT40 BCCW-18 compressor .
    Secondly Garretts uses a 56 trim GT40 BCCW-18 compressor .

    Both compressor choises are really overkill for the 60mm turbine , its all fine and well to shove air into an engine but the exhaust escapes via the turbine/housing so if mismatched banks up before the turbine . The HKS's 50T version suffers less because its smaller inducer lowers the wheels pumping capacity compared to the 56T Garrett marketed version .

    The CHRA numbers are 700177-9 for the 50T and 700177-14 for the 56T .
    If you compare exhaust manifold to inlet manifold pressure under boost the results show this combination to be a poor performer .

    IMO better options are the GT37 compressors in 52 or 56 trim depending on what airflow is required.

    Also IMO turbos should be sized to give the power required now , not with room to grow because doing it that way WILL buy boost lag now . The turbine power to drive large compressors is not free so if under utilised the wheel WILL cost you response .

    Turbine housing AR's . We should really look at turbine maps and compare them to the map of the compressor we decide to use .

    Small AR turbine housings are a bad read unsuccessful way to excite large compressors/turbos.
    The ratio variable is there to control the exhaust gas speed into the turbine blades , believe it or not small housings often cause more rotating group lag than a propper sized one .

    IMO the .63AR GT30 housing is only any good for the GT3071R or the 48 trim GT3037 . Once you get to the 52T GT3037 or 56T GT3037/GT30R its really going to need a .82AR or even the largest 1.06AR for the nth in top end .
    There you go, hope it helps

    From an S2 point of view Aronmatic2 has proved you can run the GT3076 with a .63 hotside and it actually is a very good match for the I5 engine but the .82 will give you higher top end and less chance of surge.
    Last edited by Jamo; 12 September 2007, 21:08.
  • BRY
    S2Forum Possessed
    • Nov 2004
    • 3755
    • Home: United Nations Current: Vietnam

    #2
    With Pics



    Got one yet, Jamo?
    Kingdoms are run by Kings, Dictatorships are run by Dictators.
    England must be a Country. :mischeif:

    Comment

    • aronmatic2
      S2Forum Fiend
      • Jan 2004
      • 2129
      • Country: Hungary

      #3
      good write jamo.
      we are going on the right way
      --------------------------------------------------------
      Real carbon parts for S2 and RS2. Check Carbondesign on facebook

      Comment

      • topsparky
        S2Forum Fiend
        • Oct 2005
        • 2014
        • Country: United Kingdom

        #4
        Originally posted by BRY
        With Pics



        Got one yet, Jamo?
        have n't you got small hands bry
        1. SHORT SHIFT KIT
        2. PORSCHE CAYENNE CALIPERS
        3. H & R SPRINGS
        4. BILSTEIN SHOXS
        5. NEW BUSHES AND HP2 STRUTS
        6. UPRATED HIGH OUTPUT COIL PACK
        7. ,3" turbo back s/s/ exhaust
        8. fmic fitted

        Comment

        • BRY
          S2Forum Possessed
          • Nov 2004
          • 3755
          • Home: United Nations Current: Vietnam

          #5
          Originally posted by topsparky
          have n't you got small hands bry
          Dainty
          Kingdoms are run by Kings, Dictatorships are run by Dictators.
          England must be a Country. :mischeif:

          Comment

          • topsparky
            S2Forum Fiend
            • Oct 2005
            • 2014
            • Country: United Kingdom

            #6
            Originally posted by BRY
            Dainty
            1. SHORT SHIFT KIT
            2. PORSCHE CAYENNE CALIPERS
            3. H & R SPRINGS
            4. BILSTEIN SHOXS
            5. NEW BUSHES AND HP2 STRUTS
            6. UPRATED HIGH OUTPUT COIL PACK
            7. ,3" turbo back s/s/ exhaust
            8. fmic fitted

            Comment

            • Acidburn
              S2Forum Obsessed
              • Jun 2007
              • 13459
              • Country: United Kingdom

              #7
              Lol nice turbo what size a/r ratio's it got?

              Comment

              • waad_uk
                S2Forum Addict
                • Jul 2006
                • 411
                • Country: United Kingdom

                #8
                Well at a guess the A/R is 0.7....well thats what it says on the cold side casting in that pic of a massive Turbo!
                '93 S2 Coupe

                Comment

                • Acidburn
                  S2Forum Obsessed
                  • Jun 2007
                  • 13459
                  • Country: United Kingdom

                  #9
                  and 0.82 on the inside of the second picture

                  Comment

                  • waad_uk
                    S2Forum Addict
                    • Jul 2006
                    • 411
                    • Country: United Kingdom

                    #10
                    whoops didnt see that one!!
                    '93 S2 Coupe

                    Comment

                    • Acidburn
                      S2Forum Obsessed
                      • Jun 2007
                      • 13459
                      • Country: United Kingdom

                      #11
                      So which Gt30 is it, bigger than most that i've seen....

                      Comment

                      • Jamo
                        Retired OG Mod
                        • Mar 2004
                        • 21750
                        • Country: United Kingdom

                        #12
                        Please remember guys the above are quotes not my words

                        Comment

                        • Sweeper
                          S2Forum Extremist
                          • Jul 2003
                          • 1317
                          • Country: Latvia

                          #13
                          So wich turbo configuration was the best for fast spool up and big top end HP power ?
                          Vadim.

                          New engine (mechanical PKM head) , Alcon 332mm brakes , Pauter rods , Mahle pistons, GT30R , kw v2 sucpension , new exhaust. 608HP. For SALE !

                          Comment

                          • Faheemo
                            S2Forum Maniac
                            • Feb 2005
                            • 544
                            • Country: South Africa

                            #14
                            Gt 3071 with .63 AR made me a very happy chappy - untill i went bigger. ( lag spoils the fun somewhat with my bigger turbo.)
                            If u not going for all out race performance the 3071 is the ideal turbo.
                            good spool and will hold good amount of boost to redline.

                            S2 Coupe fully built.
                            10.9 1/4mile 0-100 in 3.5secs
                            Precision 6262 turbo
                            The Green Monster

                            Comment

                            • Jamo
                              Retired OG Mod
                              • Mar 2004
                              • 21750
                              • Country: United Kingdom

                              #15
                              As Faheemo says the 3071 with a .63 is the best all rounder 450 bhp and fast spool

                              For those that are willing to except a little extra lag the 3076 on .63 or .82 will give a 475 & 515 range respectively.

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