Would this work?

[s2avant]

I've been thinking about upgrades today and came up with the following setup
based on least lag and as many O.E parts as possible.

RS2 Manifold & Turbo
3" Turbo back exhaust
Arrows rods
RS2 or better injectors

I know one of Mihnea's hybrid KKK's can manage more than the RS2 turbo but I want to keep the setup as bolt on as possible. I can't afford to be without the car for ages while I have work done so it needs to be done in stages. I was thinking exhaust first, then turbo and manifold or rods and fianlly big injectors and remap.

My questions are:

It's well documented that 550NM is the limit of the stock rods and that the RS2 turbo is capable of 600NM. What is the maximum reliable torque the RS2 turbo can produce?

What kind of power could I hope to achieve?

and finally, are RS4 injectors higher flowing than RS2 ones and do they have the right impedance? The reason I ask is that I'm I'm sure I have read somewhere that they can flow 511cc and they are also a lot cheaper than RS2 injectors.

I know a lot of this has been discussed over the past year or so but if any one can offer any input or answer the questions it would be much appreciated.

Ben

[Pisobiker]

Ben,
in my opinion, unless you're engine needs a rebuild, leave the high performance conrods for future upgrades.

Consider the gain, if any, will only be max torque @ midrange, while top Hp being setted by RS2's turbo cold side max flowing ability.

I don't think the +30/40 Nm the RS2 turbocharger might allow compared to max safe torque on stock rods, will justify the expenses not only of the rods themselves, but also of the parts and labour for changing them.
You will at least need to take off the sump and the head, therefore needing the full gasket sets, cambelt set, head bolts. Then for skimming the head you will need to take off at least intake valves, needing then new valve seals.
Once there you HAVE to change the bearings and you might even find to be wise replacing piston rings if not the whole piston+ring set, therefore needing the block to come off the car to have the cylinders honed...... not to tell some healty working on head ports and valve seats......

Lots of money, man.


As I have already said many times, in my own opinion the plain RS2 setup with the right remap is the most "costeffective" upgrade for an S2.

IE what an S2 needs is:

- RS2 EM;
- RS2 turbocharger;
- RS2 injectors or some of equivalent flow;
- RS2 or bigger intercooler;
- Remap.

Then possibly:

- Full 3" exhaust system;
- RS2 exhaust cam.
- BRAKES...... .... you got them already, though


Marco

[s2avant]

Marco,

Thanks for the reply. My main point on the rods was to build in a safety margin. I have a very heavy right foot at times and I don't want to get the conversion done and then blow it up.

The RS2 setup is the way I'm planning to go as:

a) it's the easiest
b) could cost me next to nothing if I'm really nice to the boss :mischeif:

My only concern with this is getting bored of it. If this happens though, as much as I'd love to have a 200mph 10 year old estate car, I may have to trade up to something faster

The other option of course is to leave the car standard(ish) and build a new full blown performance engine ready to go in it. Not sure my pockets are deep enough to get stuck into this yet though.

Can anyone shed light on the RS2 vs. RS4 injector specs?

Ben

[audiman]

Not sure about the injectors mate?

As far as a rebuild goes, fit some rods to whatever you are doing. I had the N75 do its own thing a while back and boost peaked at 2.3 bar until i saw the gauge and let off!!! Thats is what may have damaged my rod. Also if the car misfired that 'could' kill a rod.

The best way is to get hold of a s/h engine and strip/rebuild it with all the bits. Or blag a short block from Milton Keynes and chuck a set of rods in it!!

[S2central.net]

Marco is right on this one. The RS2 conversion is very cost effective and is a straight bolt on with no internal upgrades required - unless the mapping runs to dangerous boost levels.

There is a generic chipset for the RS2 which will give a safe 360-370bhp with strongest torque levels circa 500Nm in the mid range. I can do that for you with the necessary 3bar MAP - its Mihneas chips so he gets paid too on these. If you want to extract the absolute best performance from that setup running higher boost then it will need custom mapped by the man himself with a stiffer WG spring etc. This will of course run nearer to 550Nm (or more) so its up to you sir.

Change the injectors with the turbo and manifold is my advice also cos its real easy to change injectors and you don't want to be getting it chipped twice to accomodate different fuelling. Actually you should swap the FPR to the RS2 item as well then there will be no tweaks required in the generic RS2 chips for you.

Paul

[S2 Ant]

Ben, the RS4 is a 4.2 V8 NA correct? and the RS6 is 4.2 V8 Turbo, have these got different injectors?

As i was thinking that a turbo'd car would require more fuelling than an NA and the cylinders on the NA V8 would be almost the same size as ours, so maybe the RS6 would be required??

I dont have much of an idea about all this, but thought that might be logical?

[Jamo]

S2 Ant, i found that NA injectors flow more but have different resistance on the injectors when i did some digging a while back.
I'll dig out my old links when i get home cross referrencing all the injector to flow rates with injector numbers.

[porkkis]

Ben, the RS4 is a 4.2 V8 NA correct?

Wrong. 2.7 v6 bi-turbo.

[S2 Ant]

Thats the old one isnt it tho Porkis, thought the current models were 4.2 V8 NA for the RS4 and they just added the turbo's for the RS6

[Dr H]

Think you are getting mixed up with the new S4.

RS4 (no longer made) was a 2.7 Twin Turbo ala old S4
New S4 is a V8 AFAIK

[S2 Ant]

Ahhh Ok then, i'll shut up

[Doug_RS2]

Ben,

Go for the RS2 turbo tuned to the max by Mihnea - The low down torque you get with that will compensate for the high end power of the more powerful KKK Turbos in most driving situations on the road. If you get bored with that then, and only then, you can justify the extra hassle of upgrading more - it is a lot off work to change rods, and while you are there do you change pistons? And wwhen you get a bit more power 440bhp is the max out of the RS2 EM, do you change the EM.

I am happy with my car but I was very impressed with Sals RS2 setup - if it is cheap for you do to the genuine parts upgrade then you might as well do that first.

[S2 Ant]

More to the point... Ben your dealership would get a lot more custom if the prices were more keen

[s2avant]

More to the point... Ben your dealership would get a lot more custom if the prices were more keen

True, but sadly retail sales are small change in the big scheme of things.

Dealer prices are (to an extent) set by VAG UK. They decide what we pay for parts and tell us how much we should sell them for. They recently played about with the cost prices we get with some very interesting results.

For example: MK IV Golf door mouldings. For front door mouldings we get 31% but on rear ones we get 13.5%

On the plus side nearly all exhaust and brake components are code 2 (48.5%) now, including RS2/S2 ones. At dealer cost a pair of brand new big reds works out at about £500 including VAT.

Of course you didn't hear any of this from me

Ben