strange turbo mod?

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  • S-Express
    S2Forum Extremist
    • Nov 2006
    • 1133
    • Home: United Kingdom Current: Wales

    #1

    strange turbo mod?

    Took my spare K24 to a long-standing turbo refurb company today for a refresh.
    The place is small and run by a couple of old boys which I suspect know a fair bit about turbos. They have all the kit included balancing machine etc.
    Whilst I was there, they offered to cut back the exhaust compressor wheel slightly as it would improve pick up
    I don't doubt their knowledge BUT if that was the case - why didn't KKK do it in the first place!?
    Any thoughts?
    Thanks

    Oh, and just for info - they charged £130 for rebuild and balance with all new seals/bearings etc - including a 360 deg bearing. seems like a good price?
    sigpic
  • sam80quattro
    S2Forum Extremist
    • Oct 2006
    • 1496
    • Country: United Kingdom

    #2
    might be total ***** what im about to say but im seem to think at the expense of better pick up it creates more noise, as in whistles louder, might be **** but thats what my heads saying lol

    Comment

    • fish
      S2Forum Fiend
      • Aug 2007
      • 2333
      • Home: United Kingdom Current: Sweden

      #3
      Did you get their mod?
      Audi 80 Competition -94 Daily driver

      www.garaget.org/fish for more pic´s of my cars

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      • S-Express
        S2Forum Extremist
        • Nov 2006
        • 1133
        • Home: United Kingdom Current: Wales

        #4
        Originally posted by fish
        Did you get their mod?
        they're doing the refurb tomorrow
        sigpic

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        • Kieron20V
          S2Forum Extremist
          • Mar 2008
          • 1505
          • Home: England Current: United Kingdom

          #5
          Cutting back the turbine a little is just removing a little bit of mass from the rotating assembly. It might improve the spool up slightly due to the reduced inertia, but i would imagine at the expense of some overall efficiency. Might be worth it if youre keeping it bog standard.
          1994 URS4 Avant RS2+

          Comment

          • Billman
            S2Forum Freak
            • Nov 2004
            • 4129

            #6
            I believe it would spool later but if the turbine impeller is the limiting factor on a give turbo the cutback impeller will allow better flow.

            Smaller blades, less weight (spins easier) but also smaller surface for the gasses to hit (worse spool but more flowing through).
            Go Holset or Go RS4

            Comment

            • david
              S2Forum Extremist
              • Oct 2008
              • 1268
              • Country: United Kingdom

              #7
              would'nt it be better to use lighter more modern compressor wheel?
              [SIGPIC][SIGPIC]/SIGPIC]92 3B pearl white=gone back home to Germany,probably in bits and pieces

              RS2 VOLCANO BLACK] soon to be broken to bits

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              • david
                S2Forum Extremist
                • Oct 2008
                • 1268
                • Country: United Kingdom

                #8
                Originally posted by Billman
                I believe it would spool later but if the turbine impeller is the limiting factor on a give turbo the cutback impeller will allow better flow.

                Smaller blades, less weight (spins easier) but also smaller surface for the gasses to hit (worse spool but more flowing through).
                what do you think of say 5 blades instead of 6 ?
                [SIGPIC][SIGPIC]/SIGPIC]92 3B pearl white=gone back home to Germany,probably in bits and pieces

                RS2 VOLCANO BLACK] soon to be broken to bits

                Comment

                • Gringo
                  S2Forum Enthusiast
                  • Jan 2005
                  • 139
                  • Country: United States

                  #9
                  Cutback is an old rallycross trick. In the good `ol days most large turbos where made for trucks, ie. diesel engines with low revs. These turbos had large compressors and small turbines. To make these turbos work for small displacement, high reving engines they cutback the blades on the exhaust side. This allows for higher exhaust flows and higher rpms ie. making the turbo more suitable for the application.

                  In your case, it will make the turbo spool slower, but it will move the point where backpressure exceeds inlet pressure up in the rpm range. This is a good thing if you are building an old school rallycross engine and letting your compressor work beyond it`s limits
                  Now you see me, now you don`t

                  80quattro.com

                  Comment

                  • Gringo
                    S2Forum Enthusiast
                    • Jan 2005
                    • 139
                    • Country: United States

                    #10
                    Just to back up my statement ;

                    Turbine Wheel Cutback
                    Turbine Wheel Cutback is a machining process which enables the turbocharger to increase power output by reducing back pressure. This process does remove some blade material from the turbine wheel which normally results in a slight reduction in turbocharger response. If you're unsure of how back pressure influences a turbocharger imagine running a marathon with a finger up your nose!

                    From; http://www.turbodynamics.co.uk/servi...bine-upgrades/
                    Now you see me, now you don`t

                    80quattro.com

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                    • Sleeper_Avant
                      S2Forum Fiend
                      • Mar 2009
                      • 2372
                      • Country: England

                      #11
                      Very common on cosworth/ford mainly garrett turbos, very efficiant and cost effective turbo tweek!
                      1993 URS4 Avant Emerald Green 350+bhp
                      1991 Ford Sierra Sapphire 4x4 in Magenta
                      BoooOOOSSSSSTTTT BANG BANG CHIRP CHIRP

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                      • rj scotty
                        S2Forum Fiend
                        • May 2006
                        • 2195
                        • Home: United Kingdom Current: England

                        #12
                        Give it a go !

                        If you don't like it stick it on ebay and get another k24, there are cheap after all.
                        sigpic
                        "For what you spent on that you could have brought a new car"
                        BUT I DON'T WANT A NEW CAR!

                        1995 S2 Avant, Volcano Black
                        1982 VW Golf Mk1, primer yellow, will be finished one day, maybe.
                        2003 VW T4 long nose X pack, (has become project)

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                        • Billman
                          S2Forum Freak
                          • Nov 2004
                          • 4129

                          #13
                          Originally posted by david
                          what do you think of say 5 blades instead of 6 ?
                          You will not find a turbine impeller with so few blades.

                          On compressor impellers with same dimensions and same impeller design characteristics the fewer blades would have the following impact:

                          1. Less airflow on the lower turbocharger revs

                          2. Faster spool ( less weight)

                          3. Better top end flow because one less blade need to "cut" the air
                          Go Holset or Go RS4

                          Comment

                          • sam80quattro
                            S2Forum Extremist
                            • Oct 2006
                            • 1496
                            • Country: United Kingdom

                            #14
                            Originally posted by sam80quattro
                            might be total ***** what im about to say but im seem to think at the expense of better pick up it creates more noise, as in whistles louder, might be **** but thats what my heads saying lol
                            see i was right, i am full of ***** lol

                            Comment

                            • Gringo
                              S2Forum Enthusiast
                              • Jan 2005
                              • 139
                              • Country: United States

                              #15
                              I cant really understand why some of you are still recommending him to do this mod? Unless he has backpressure issues this mod wil give him poorer performance. Money wasted most likely.
                              Now you see me, now you don`t

                              80quattro.com

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