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Ques. re Pairing of MacP. strut's spring hardware

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  • Ques. re Pairing of MacP. strut's spring hardware

    This is primarily about the use of OE upper spring discs (aka upper spring perches), P/N suffix 111B and 113 (1st two photos below and item 29 in 3rd shot) but also asks about the cup spacer (item 28), and involves consideration of the strut, front or rear, and of course the particular spring one wants to hold captive.

    a) I'll begin by asking if as examples, a 1985 quattro and/or the S2 3B/ABY w/AC springs (last shot below) left the factory with the shorter type 111B discs (always found on just the rear struts of 7A coupes and sedans in North America) atop their front springs, as there is at least some unofficial written evidence such was the case (see 3rd and 4th screen-shots).

    b) It may be that wherever the type 113 was used, it was accompanied by cup spacer item 28 underneath but never under the type 111B? IIRC, this convex-topped washer is about 3mm thick, but perhaps counter-intuitively, because it is not in the vertical weight-bearing load path of an installed strut, its' presence or absence does not alter the effective height of the strut. What purpose do you suppose it might serve?

    c) No doubt some folks here have tried 111B types in place of their taller 113 types on the front struts. If yes, can you please comment on any perhaps basic fitment issues, and might you know of any combinations (with particular springs) which during use, may not sufficiently restrain the installed spring in situ under all conditions, if any. I ask as the front and rear struts lower perches are at slightly different heights on the struts (the rear struts lower perch being higher up), and the effective heights of various OE springs vary. So for instance, swapping the 7A's tall front top perches (113's) for shorter 111B rears, onto the front struts might result in a spring (particularly a short spring) that could get loose on full droop (I have not tested this)?

    d) Although I have no personal interest to lower the front or raise the rear ride heights of mine, but depending your answers, some may want to use or avoid some of the possible combinations?

    For those who might be interested, what I did do with all my perches was (very tediously, due to the odd and non-flat shapes), carve some plastic isolator plates to separate the spring from both the upper and lower perches. I didn't like the metal to metal squirming at the lowest coil to lower perch contact area of the stock install and occasional 'twang' that occurs while getting underway, and these plates also helped to negate that my springs are slightly shorter than stock.

    Spring disc upper 893 412 111B Screen Shot 2021-06-04 at 23.24.50.png Spring disc upper 893 412 113 Screen Shot 2021-06-04 at 23.26.07.png S2 front strut parts 7Zap Screen Shot 2021-06-04 at 23.06.51.png items 28 cup spacer and 29 spring disc Screen Shot 2021-06-04 at 23.12.03.png item 19 S2 3b ABY AC springs Screen Shot 2021-06-04 at 23.10.49.png
    Last edited by Lago Blue; 5 June 2021, 12:53.

  • #2
    S2s got 857 412 111 B on the front and rear. My 90 20v has the 893 412 113 part on the front and they can rust through if the curved washer is missing - see the pic
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    This gallery has 1 photos.


    • #3
      Thanks for that sir,

      And perhaps no S2s came w/o AC?

      If yes, it may then follow that 111 B spring discs on S2 front struts would mean the effective length (or height) of those w/AC springs is longer than non-AC non-S2 Coupe springs by the height difference between the two disc types - 6mm. Perhaps a longer spring was needed to get sufficient rate with the increased S2 weight? Would a 90 20v Q with 1BE suspension have the same static suspension height as an S2?

      Yet the even heavier AAH Coupes appears to have had the tall 113 discs. Puzzling.

      93 Coupe front strut spring discs Screen Shot 2021-06-05 at 21.20.47.png

      That 'cup-spacer' curved washer is plated steel, so I'm not certain how its' presence under the disc could prevent the disc from rusting? Might it be that the drain-hole in the 113 disc was plugged? Except that the rust appears to be above the possible high-water mark. Also puzzling.


      • #4
        I've had 2 S2 Coupes and neither had air con. In the UK air-con was an expensive option (>1k) and not really required when these were new. My 90 quattro 20v is a sport but 1BE on the data sticker didn't exist until after 1992 - ride is lower due to tyre profile. These top perches are not related to air con or not. It's all down to spring type


        • #5
          I should have said axle height to be more clear, but that's right - the 90q20V sedans on 15's (mine came on 14's) are listed with the shorter (than those on the S2) 205/50 tires.
          Perhaps by type you mean S2 type front springs as a group came fitted with 111 B's, and the rest (80's, 90's, non-S2 Coupes, Avants, RS2's) all got 113's, correct?


          • #6
            yeah, for whatever reason the cars with heavy duty springs like the S2 Coupe, avant and RS2 all got 857 parts at the front. Lower power models got the later 893 parts.