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UrS6 - Replacement of Parts in Front Suspension - Tips

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  • UrS6 - Replacement of Parts in Front Suspension - Tips

    Just a couple of pointers for members with a C4q who need to change the shock / springs or the lower control arm.

    I done it four times on four different cars and at last have found a sequence of steps that make it easy for me. As up until now it has been a ball breaker of a job.

    Hopefully you'll be able to follow what I'm attempting to impart.

    The points below do not include every single step but just the ones you need to be sure to be aware of / follow, the less obvious steps are not mentioned. And as Dave says YMMV, and you do it at you own risk and I'm taking no responsibility for any harm you come to or damage you cause etc. etc.

    1. Loosen the five road wheel bolts and also the centre bolt (size 27) into the CV joint.

    2. Jack up car and put axle stands in place.

    3. Take off the wheel, the break caliper - use a brake pad spreader to get the caliper over your worn / stepped brake disc, also take off the lid of the brake fluid reservoir and syringe out some brake fluid before and to avoid any issues with too much pressure and overflowing brake fluid, s the brake pads are pushed back.

    4. Undo the nut of the nut and bolt for the ball joint clamp. Use a pry bar to lever down the top of the ball joint a bit to allow the bolt to be withdrawn easily rather than unwinding it out with a ratchet and socket and grinding the top off the threads. Or whacking it out with a hammer and punch. While it is a good idea to replace this particular nut on bolt particularly so if it is the original. If it is new, doing it this way will not wreck it prematurely.

    5. Generously spray GT85 on all your bolts and nuts to give yourself every assistance with these works.

    6. With the CV centre bolt removed, and bolt (16) that holds the lower control arm to the subframe / body loosened and removed use a Teng Gasket Scraper ‘screwdriver’ as a chisel to ‘slice’ through the relatively thin but still strong aluminium sleeve that should be in place on this sub frame bolt . It is well worth buying two of these Teng gasket scrapers, one for it’s intended use, and the second for ‘wrecking’ on various car jobs as it so thin it can reach areas that other tools can’t!

    Trust me you’ll find plenty of uses to the second one. I used mine to slice though the aluminium sleeve of the rear subframe bolt that holds the end of the lower control arm (LCA), in place, and it didn’t make a mark on the bevelled edge. Otherwise one of the suggested methods of screwing up a wheel bolt into the recess of the bush to grip the sleeve and withdraw it never worked for me, and I had to resort to brute force and ignorance / torture to get it and the LCA out. Once the LCA bolt and aluminium sleeve are out, the arm comes straight out of the subframe slot, allowing the ball joint to be easily removed.

    No need to think of / undertake the removal of the front anti roll bar (FARB), which only helps to a certain extent, and not completely in the disassembly of the various parts you’re wrestling / struggling with / cursing and then you also have the hassle of putting it back together when reassembling all of the parts. Anyone whose done this will remember the fun they had with the four sets of nut and bolts for the two FARB clamps. In particular positioning and securing nuts ‘inside ‘the subframe while attempting to get the bolts started in the respective bolts and tightening up the bolts fully.

    This method allows you ‘break’ the annoying / frustrating/ challenging triangle of tension between the LCA, the FARB, and the subframe.

    7. When the strut/shock/spring are finally placed in the vice on your work bench ready for disassembly, and assuming you’ve used decent spring compressors to get the top mounts off and keep your face and hands in tact you’ll now be looking at the rust cap nut holding the shock in place. Up until now I used a big plumber’s pipe wrench and a long length of tube to open the cap, ripping the edge of the cap etc.

    8. I used a double ended combination box tube spanner, can’t remember the exact size right now, (26?), will up date in two weeks with size and link to a photo. Using a pipe wrench on the outside of this tube spanner allows you to open the strut cap with ease / pleasure.

    Assuming you’ve changed the shocks and or the springs and are now ready to reassemble the parts,

    9. Skipping various straightforward steps, you’ve put the new LCA back in position, with the thin metal sleeve, the correct way round, tapped back into position and started the bolt into subframe bush just a couple of threads to leave the LCA some additional flexibility you move.

    10. Leave the plastic protective cap on the LCA ball joint as long as possible to protect the rubber boot from tearing damage.

    11. You then have put back the top mount spring/shock/ strut housing back in position.

    12. You manoeuvre the CV joint back into place at the end of the strut housing, and put the bolt (27) loosely into position by just tightening by say 5 turns.

    13. This next bit is the key to your success. You want to be to move the threaded end of the FRAB bar through the hole of the LCA without damaging the threads, and then get the ball joint in it’s ‘hole’ in the bottom of the strut housing.

    14. Wrap insulating tape around the end of the FARB just next to the threaded section. Gives extra grip to the jubilee clip, and stop it from scratching/gouging the paint on the FARB.

    15. Tighten a jubilee clip onto this taped section leaving room for the hook of a substantial ratchet strap. Do not be tempted to try it with a flimsy strap. The FARB is far too stiff, you need a bib strong one for doing what I'm suggesting. Worth buying specifically just for this particular job, as they not that dear compared to the help it will give you in allowing you to get this pita of a job done so easily.

    16. Tighten a ratchet strap in a loop around the taped section of the FARB and around the opposite side’s subframe. Tighten the ratchet strap and it will draw in the FARB allowing you to manoeuvre the LCA ‘hole’ onto the FARB. Make sure to have the large washer and the first bush in place first. Once through the hole put the second washer and large washer in place and then put the nut (24 - deep socket is handier) in place with a couple of turns.

    17. Next get an assistant, and get them to place a long stout tube on top of the LCA and underneath the sub frame. Put rags on the tube at the two contact points to stop paint being damage and rust starting. Ask the assistant to press downwards on the tube to lever down on the LCA while you simultaneously take off the plastic cap on the ball joint that protects the rubber boot. You then manoeuvre around the new and stiff ball joint to get it to be able to move more readily to allow you to be able to position it correctly to line up with the ‘hovering’ hole above at the bottom of the strut housing. The big long tube can then be ‘let off a bit at a time to allow the ball joint to be released’ into it’s resting / home position.

    18. Then you put the ball joint’s bolt back into position using a pry bar to get the bolt it etc. rather than hammering it in. Then put the nut on and tighten it up. (16 x 2).

    19. Carefully release the ratchet strap, and set it all up in reverse to allow you to do the same operation / procedure with the other side.

    20. It sounds difficult when you write it out, but in practice it is a joy compared to my previous episodes / struggles with this particular job on a C4q.

    Other points.

    Wire brush rust off bolts and threads in particular either using a wire brush in drill or a bench grinder with a wire brush attachment. Take the opportunity to take out the ABS sensor and clean out all of the rust in this hole and on the copper sleeve insert. Reassemble with lots of copper grease. Perfect for next time.

    Copper grease everything tbh before reassembly. When you come to take it all apart again, you be delighted with yourself for doing so.

    Up until now I found this a pig of a job, now almost looking forward to the next time.

    Away on holidays currently, with beers on board on a balcony taking in the imminent sunset, so please correct any errors or serious omissions.

    HTH someone as it would be nice to give back something to the forum that has helped me so much. Especially so when I recall how little I knew about an I5 20vt S cars back in 2005 having just bought the first one, an S2 Avant.

    Additionally while it is written ostensively for others, it is also written from me so as I can remember how to do it next time.

    If I knew then what I knew now etc. etc.

    Sorry the post is so long but hard to say all of the above any shorter.

    Any comments or feedback welcome, just so as I know others have experienced the same issue, and that I’m not doing it in the totally wrong manner, or that I just haven’t got a clue.

    Now going back to the fridge again for more beer and also some crisps.

    Last edited by macspring; 17 October 2015, 21:53.

  • #2
    C4 UrS Front Suspension PNs and Torque Values

    In case someone needs this:

    http://12v.org/urs/FrontSuspensionTorqueValues.PDF

    RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
    94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by macspring View Post
      10. Leave the plastic protective cap on the LCA ball joint as long as possible to protect the rubber boot from tearing damage.
      That tip should happen latest around this point, preferrably before:
      Pry open the spring clips and take off the boot of the joint. add liberal ammount of CV joint grease (i mean so much that you begin to wonder if the boot can fit back).

      Lately i have noticed that the ammount of grease from factory is the size of a pea, sometimes a well dried one. Anyway the CV grease will spread evenly around the balljoint when the boot is compressed, it has never leaked out on assembly. Out of 3 C4 specimens i have added the extra grease none of them the balljoint has not died yet (around 2 years, but one of them should soon, i there was a pinhole in the dustboot when i last saw it)

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi Zoig, thanks for your advices.

        How do you get the boot back on ?

        I'm thinking, I'd use a fine metal spike Craftsman 'screwdriver' I have to slide down the side of the ball joint and into the inside of the top end of the boot, and then to use a big syringe filled with the relevant grease, and have a needle attachment on the end of the syringe to allow the grease to be 'injected' into the boot, without having to take off the boot.

        The Craftsman screw driver is a great tool and is used much more frequently than you'd think. When you get it in a set of screwdrivers, you think, what's this for, who decided to bother making this, but as mentioned, it is a great 'yoke'.

        Dave or Tom might be able to post the relevant photo of it.

        Thanks again Zoig for your input.

        Goes to the medicine cabinet for the pain in the head.





        Last edited by macspring; 21 March 2017, 20:05.

        Comment


        • #5
          Anybody know the standard spring rates for a URS6/S4 ? Can't seem to find that info anywhere.. :/
          C4 A6 AEL avant quattro: daily

          TYPE-85 Coupe Quattro: clicky
          2.5L GTi engineering RE2500 190hp.180lb
          Schrick 272 cam
          C A C 2.5" T304 Exhaust
          ITG filter

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          • #6
            Big thank you Macspring and Urs4boy, having just replaced everything on the front end, the ratchet strap made the assembly job very straight forward, having the torque values printed off and armed with a white marker the job is done. The wheel alignment didn't happen at the first place it was booked into, he was honest and said he had never done a C4 and recommended an other shop.

            Comment


            • #7
              Great thread thanks to all contributors
              sigpic
              Cab 2.3E
              90q
              URS6

              Comment


              • #8
                Hello, I would like to ask, if somebody has driven the urs4 on track? I am worried about the front axle, because Audi designed this type of suspension obviously for comfort, not for performance. Have anybody tried to convert c4 "antirollbar-arm" to "normal" type of mcperson? Or may I use a good polybush and everything will be fine?
                1992 Audi Urs4 Avant

                Comment


                • #9
                  If you must track a UrS4, then poly bush would be the logical first step forward.

                  If you are asking should you put double wish bone front suspension on it, and if you can't do it yourself, then it may be best to accept the limits of a UrS4 on the track and enjoy it for what it can do, or change to a more suitable car for the track ?

                  Sorry if this comes across as too harsh, but just my own thoughts.

                  No offence intended.





                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by halo View Post
                    Have anybody tried to convert c4 "antirollbar-arm" to "normal" type of mcperson?
                    Not common, but I have seen a few

                    http://www.motorgeek.com/viewtopic.p...16801&start=25


                    http://mulk.planet.ee/galerii/silla%...reenwidth=1366


                    Or Hap's way

                    http://www.s2forum.com/forum/showthr...=45338&page=12
                    Current-2004 Impreza PPP wagon

                    Sold-92 3B coupe-RS2+, 996s, konis, rear torsen, forged rods........
                    Sold ABY-stock

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