Ur Quattro outer CV joints

[Tractor Dave]

Can anyone tell me what outer CV joints work on a 1986 Wr Ur with abs?
I currently have SKF VKJA5179 fitted on the car but apparently the speed rings needed changing to allow them to work. KMS say I need VKJA5185 but 7Zap says otherwise.
The joints on the car are very stiff and have heat marks even though they have only done a few thousand miles since fitting 3 years ago

[trichter05]

Sounds like they where running without grease?!
Im no expert for Ur parts, because I haven´t one yet, but I can tell you VKJA5185 is without ABS.
VKJA5179 should be right, equivalent to: 443 498 099 AX

[Tractor Dave]

Plenty of grease in there. I think lack of use and grease has solidified? Or maybe fake goods?

[trichter05]

As you now, you can´t buy better aftermarket Joints than SKF. But you could give the FAG 771 0009 30 a shot.
And/or you use a uprated grease next time. I know shouldn´t necessary if it´s genuine SKF parts.
Some swear on this VW Group grease: G 052 723 A2 (does come from the R8, what I heard) 15€ a tube.

[Lago Blue]

Are the "heat marks" you see, a regular pattern of a sort of graduated - rainbow - corona around the entire joint and its' features? Perhaps post a photo, as these may be what are simply a result of the manufacturing process (heat-treatment?), and still visible if they have not been corroded away. Entirely plausible that the grease may simply be old. Careful disassembly with notes and containers plus inspection of the races will tell. Balls are replaceable if required.

[Tractor Dave]

Hi Lago
I appreciate your input. The heat marks are in line with each ball. There are marks inside the race but not major and the balls all look good. I stripped them down and cleaned, put each ball back in the same slot and 're greased but it's still really tight

[Lago Blue]

Hi Dave,

Re: "really tight / stiff joints". With used CV's, cleaning and new grease, they really shouldn't be. Does this same effect occur at all the joints? This is a new to you car, correct? Do you think it might be possible that as received, the CV's might have been re-assembled incorrectly previously? For instance, do the wide joint inner race sections align with the narrow outer race sections (and vice versa)? Below attached, the first photo shows evidence of heat treatment on a new joint's outer race, 2nd photo shows the correctly assembled alternating pattern of, in between the balls, always a wide race section lined-up across the gap from a narrow section.

new cv outer race heat-treatment pattern.png cv joint assembly wide to narrow clocking.png

[Tractor Dave]

Interesting thought. I agree, they shouldn't be stiff at all. I've done plenty of CV joints over the years and never come across this. I have bought new so they will be going in the scrap box. They are correctly assembled. I can't post pics right now as tapatalk isn't working. The heat marks are on the outside. We are getting a lot of counterfeit parts here and I do suspect they are not SKF at all but some cheap Chinese copy
Apparently, SKF destroyed several million seized counterfeit wheel bearings recently. The only way to tell they were fake was by cutting them open. They were that good a copy.

[Bowie69]

The heat marks are definitely localised (induction?) hardening, nothing to worry about at all.

Without this, the balls would eat the surrounding material in no time.

[Tractor Dave]

https://www.securingindustry.com/electronics-and-industrial/skf-destroys-1m-worth-of-fake-bearings/s105/a3178/#.Xu3PKl3TW9c

[Tractor Dave]

The heat marks are definitely localised (induction?) hardening, nothing to worry about at all.

Without this, the balls would eat the surrounding material in no time.

Ok, get that but why is the joint so stiff. You can't move it by hand at all.

[Lago Blue]

Thanks for that link re fake bearings, I had no idea, although I'd heard of issues with fake aircraft fasteners. I note also in that same article, a link to similar for the Schaeffler Group (which also owns FAG, INA & LUK) and remember seeing some (I thought at the time) odd bearings in top-mounts (not the expected usual INA's) and so perhaps we all need to be more wary.