Insane Idea - would this work?

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  • Jonnybravo
    S2Forum Fiend
    • Aug 2008
    • 2051
    • Country: United Kingdom

    #31
    I agree with both of those posts, I don't think people realise how much a good "package" costs. Doing the engine is one thing, getting the rest of the car upto a suitable standard costs more.

    The only thing that tempts me into tuning a S2 is simply the power you can get from the engine but the rest falls far behind todays technology, that Evo for example would totally destroy most S2's point to point, reasonably reliably as well but like any car if your into it enough you will stick with it but be prepared to spend some serious cash as out of the box a S2 is very outdated these days, you just can't deny its rarity though and the fact that it is nice to be different.

    You have to keep in mind that some of the foreign stuff you read about or watch videos of are built as nearly money no object cars, wether the guys do ALL the fab work themselves the parts cost thousands, I've probably spent 10k on my Escort shell inc paint and buying the shell in the first place, however even if I had of done all of it myself it would still be considered more than most people would want to spend on a "toy", lets not forget a proper specced Mk2 Escort will cost between 50-80k if not more if your serious about competeting so mine is still built on a massive budget really.

    I've recently taken on a job building a Astra for someone, engine spec will exceed 500hp but the owner had worked out it would cost 8k for the engine, when he came to drop the engine off I quickly went through some prices and we were already at 12k for a running package and I know there is a lot of other parts involved that I'll need along the way, he nearly fell off his chair and I won't be suprised if I get a call sometime soon saying he wants to lower the spec a little as 12k was the engine alone, not inc gearbox, suspension, brakes, exhaust and mapping etc..

    By the sounds of it ( and don't take this the wrong way) you haven't considered what all these parts cost and if you even need them, I don't know your financial position but no matter how loaded you may be you really need to work out how much the whole thing will cost start to finish and if its more than you hoped then look to see where you can save some money now before your deep into it and suddenly realise its never going to be completed and end up like the others Rusty mentioned.

    Just my 2p's worth from making those mistakes in the past

    Comment

    • Keeper of The Kitten
      S2Forum Fiend
      • Dec 2003
      • 2317
      • Country: England

      #32
      Originally posted by dest
      Would the hassles and logistics of moving the rad to the boot really be worth it?
      Totally agree with Dest, there's not enough good reason to move it from the front - the airflow to a rear mounted rad is never going to be as efficient so the cooling requirements end up being impaired. Always weigh up the total benefit of doing something, the change in the weight distribution isn't worth the hassle.

      Also tend to agree that fully caging it out is a little excessive, in fact that just adds a shed load more weight and will likely increase the CofG height too, given that much tubing will be high up in the car. Tying the suspension points together is a nicety but a full cage isn't a necessity.

      Having said that, I don't see any reason to be a pussy - if you want to go for a race car fit for the road, why not?! It doesn't require you to drive stupid fast, stripped out can get you up to (legal) speeds quicker. There are plenty of modern performance cars on the road that can go, stop and corner quicker than many stripped out specials based on older models, so you'd not be creating something that outrageous.

      Insurance isn't an issue - my own insurer already quotes on power output specifically and has clearly stated to me that any modification is fine with them (including things like full cages and extensive modifications to drivetrain and shell/body). Just depends on what you want to spend.

      Biggest issue really is going to be if you've got the willpower to see a heavy project through, if you have then I want to see the fruits of your labours!
      Martin Cutting

      aka Keeper of "The Teutonic Kitten"

      It's not better than sex, but it runs it a close second.

      Comment

      • PeteUr
        S2Forum Addict
        • Jan 2010
        • 331
        • Country: Togo

        #33
        Who's your insurance company martin?


        Sapphire cos running custom 2.8litre conversion,es cos rims,raven black leather interior and 500+ with the gas turned off.

        Audi s2 cooking on gas

        Comment

        • Puglife
          S2Forum Maniac
          • Jun 2006
          • 731
          • Country: United Kingdom

          #34
          As said, insurance wont be majorly different, but it wont be the same as a stock S2!
          Road legal often brings up wild discussion.... to be road legal you need an MOT. Look on VOSA site and there should be an MOT checklist there, the tick sheet for MOT testers. Having worked in an MOT station its not as complex to get a car through one as is often made out.

          Lights, horn, no rust, no leaking exhaust, seatbelts for any seats and good tyres. If mechanicals are all up to scratch its just the stupid ticklist then. Numberplate lights, washers etc.
          Jay - pug_life85@hotmail.com

          1986 Audi UR quattro - WORK IN PROGRESS
          1981 VW Mk1 Golf - "20v Jim, but not as we know it!"

          Comment

          • Chris5044
            S2Forum Extremist
            • Feb 2005
            • 1663
            • Country: United Kingdom

            #35
            @Keeper, what is your insurance btw ?

            @ everyone ...... what are the benefits of getting an aby? is the battery in the back? anything else other than sixth gear? someone said its easier to tune??

            Comment

            • Error404
              Super Moderator
              • Mar 2007
              • 19789
              • Country: United Kingdom

              #36
              ABY coupe battery box is under the rear seat, easy enough to install it there on a 3B though, as I have on my CQ

              There are positives and negatives to ABYs and 3Bs as many will argue either way, but most will agree a hybrid of the two is the best all rounder
              Panthero Coupé quattro 20vt
              Indigo ABY coupé
              Imola B6 S4 Avant

              Comment

              • Chris5044
                S2Forum Extremist
                • Feb 2005
                • 1663
                • Country: United Kingdom

                #37
                What do you suggest? is there anyone here who could summerise this very quickly please? I'm trying to see if its more suited for me to get an ABY or a 3B ..... last time I had a 3B. They are lighter and cheaper. But I heard ABY's were best setup to tune.?? coil packs etc...

                Comment

                • terrybullwon
                  S2Forum Zealot
                  • Mar 2006
                  • 8782
                  • Country: England

                  #38
                  Originally posted by Chris5044
                  Im thinking about coming back with a bang...

                  was thinking - rent barn .. get old s2 .... and rebuild engine to 400+ horsepower with smoothest delivery I can get..

                  strip it down , get roll cage in there and radiator in boot .. - wide arches, comotive wheels.

                  carbon fibre / light doors... replace glass with perspex...

                  racing seats ..... air vents to rad in back ...


                  2 things baffle me ----

                  A -- would this be road legal? and if not how would i make it road legal?


                  B -- also insurance? how far will an insurance company go? ... and would i get insured by anybody?



                  ideas thoughts?

                  If your doing this, it really does not matter if you have a ABY or a 3B as the cars shell is going to be the same at the end of the day bar a few little points. Its not like your keeping the fuel tank or anything when you cage it.

                  And also your going to have to make lots of cuts and welds etc etc, so something not so special might be a good start.

                  3B will come with a dizzy and ABY coil packs, its up to you which way you tune the engine either Motronics or After market EMS.
                  Chef

                  Comment

                  • Chris5044
                    S2Forum Extremist
                    • Feb 2005
                    • 1663
                    • Country: United Kingdom

                    #39
                    Can anyone actually answer my Question please? Pros and cons of ABY vs 3B

                    @Terry Im not so sure on this crazy idea atm.... itd be an interesting thought .. but for now I need to determine which to go for as a starting base. Because I do not have a garage or the tools to carry out such a project yet. That is also why im umming and ahhing .... With me I like to do my research 100% before i make a decision, because it invloves alot of time and money into such a thing.

                    Comment

                    • Rusty
                      Super Moderator
                      • Jun 2004
                      • 18953
                      • Country: United Kingdom

                      #40
                      3B is cheaper and lighter (as stock). ABY doesn't suffer from distriubutor related issues, has a stronger gearbox and more space under the bonnet.

                      Start with an ABY and fit a 3B flywheel, then you're on the right track IMO.
                      Cheers'en, AndyC
                      1994 ABY Coupe - Projekt Alpinweiss

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