Vems firmware 1.1.81 has release status

[dkw_dude]

I'm all ears/eyes, trying to learn from others as I try to tune the ignition myself. Carefully, trying not to destroy the engine. So far so good.
The "injector angle" on the 1.1.81 FW, will it improve a angine with standard cams, or is it good only for high lift high duration setups. I'm considering upgrading from 1.1.70.

[Jamo]

I'm all ears/eyes, trying to learn from others as I try to tune the ignition myself. Carefully, trying not to destroy the engine. So far so good.
The "injector angle" on the 1.1.81 FW, will it improve a angine with standard cams, or is it good only for high lift high duration setups. I'm considering upgrading from 1.1.70.

Any cams will benefit from the angle configuration if setup correctly

Next week I'll do some more playing with mine, I've seen two different approaches to the angle tuning and I want to see which is better although I already know the answer in reality

[dkw_dude]

Nice, thanks.

[GazzaG60]

a lot of tuning is confidence. this comes with time.

as long as you know what should happen after the changes its a good thing.

others may disagree im not sure but without divulging timing maps which can be precious ther are certain maxes and minimums i think you can work with.

off boost in the mid section i think 35 degrees is within reach. up top is dependent of boost.

the old classic rule was 1 degree of timing reduction for every psi. this is safe for sure.

around idle i have about 20 degrees. at 1.9 bar about 18 degrees. maybe a fraction less. i keep it just off optimum shall we say so that in case i cannot get 99ron fuel or its bad fuel.

so thats
20 around idle
35ish around the middle (start around 30 and work up)
18 ish at the top. (start around 14and work up.)

its dependent on compression and turbo also. mines a bigger turbo so the numbers run from about 3k up to 7500. on say an rs2 turbo the peak numbers maybe a lot lower so say 2.5k-6k. compression wise im about 8:1. i have skimmed pistons.

lets not get into detailed maps to save conflicts of opinion but i asume we are happy to talk lows and highs?

[loxxrider]

Gazza, I agree entirely with your tuning theories.

Tuning is complicated if you really look into it, but if you take it at face value, its really quite easy and the car tells you exactly what it wants. This only works if you have a bit of common sense and a good general knowledge however.

For fuel its easy. I just shoot for .9 lambda up to about 200kpa and above that I fatten it up a bit to maybe .85 and then .8 lambda. Out of boost I just go as lean as possible until the car bucks and then add a percent or two to the VE table.

Timing is more difficult of course, but can be done on the street via "feel," knock sensor (headphones), and most importantly (in my opinion) an EGT sensor. EGT will go up with too much timing OR to little timing. You want to sit in the valley where EGT is at its lowest. Also, the car will make less power when it starts detonating. That is of course easier to see on the dyno. Also reading plugs give a great idea of where your timing is.

I haven't played with my timing much because I still don't have an EGT unfortunately. I expect to pick up a crap ton of power with timing and leaning the car out some. General rule of thumb...if it feels faster or better, then the tune is better. If it feels worse, then you are going the wrong way. Engines like good tunes

[Jamo]

I managed to have my 1st serious play with 1.1.81 sat on a running engine.

I will say when connected to the ecu use the validate config button, I saved the created 1.1.81 map and had been working offline with it but have noticed a lot of the new values put into the ecu cause conflicts or insane values.

Monday will be playing a bit now with the injector trim and bit of road testing.

[A80Avant]

you mean new values from 1.1.80 to 1.1.81 caused conflicts after transfer, or that new features had crazy values? How did the car run?

did you put the NTC sensor in yet?

[Jamo]

some new and some existing that I don't use had silly values, if you do validate config it will tell you a lot of values are insane or conflict, it's just a case of correcting them after you've upgraded the ecu.

NTC is on hold, I have the sensor but my ecu is going back for some new wheel speed hardware to be added so I can use the stock vr instead of fitting an aftermarket hall sensor

[A80Avant]

yes, im doing that on mine as well, definitelly want to use gear depended boost. Also i will be adding the anytrim feature for boost purposes with a potentiometer, which hopefully make boost control easier (according to mattias that is over at vemsforum).

Is there actually hardware to be installed on an ecu to see speed? I thought that by connecting the blue/white cable from the dash, same used for cruisecontrol the ecu would be able to read speed after setting the parameters on the software.

[GazzaG60]

why do you want gear dependent boost on a car so tractable?

i can understand on a fwd car to get the most down but not opne of these.

i want all the boost all the time

[Billman]

[A80Avant]

well you say that because you have never used VEMS for boost control. On both turbos i have used, (even on the holset shortly, but i dont count it in), i found that on lower gears i got high overboost and then it dropped on the later revs. The opposite happens in 5th or 6th gear. So in VEMS to get a middle option i have to reduce the boost from 2500-3800rpm so that i dont overboost on 2nd or 3d gear, BUT i loose the early high boost i would get on 5th and 6th. on the other hand if i elevate the boost for rpm from 6000-7600rpm so that on 3d gear it holds the value i want, then on 5th or 6th it will rise to levels i dont want to

eg.i set the boost scale to accomodate 3d gear : 3000rpm-> 270kpa and 6000rpm 320kpa (so 3d gear holds around 300kpa all the way)
however on 5th it actually goes to 320kpa on high rpm which i dont want to!!

possibly it could help if i used the DC table to do boost, but maybe not.

So with gear depended boost, i can actually do whatever i want! AND not have to buy an electronic boost controller!!

[GazzaG60]

or just buy a boost controller and be done with it once and for all. no need to worry about vems firmware changes to boost or any of of that.

to be honest vas it sounds like poor solenoid control. maybe something you cant really do much about.

i get classic big turbo boost more gas more boost. so 1st and second can produce upto 0.3 bar less than 4,5,6

[GazzaG60]

lol back to the boost controller. why do i always end up there?

[A80Avant]

honestly, i dont know!!! i just dont want any more gadgets in my car. By the way, the electronic controller also has gear depended boost, i would probably use it there as well! im a control freak!