Ignition switch playing up...

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  • steve briance
    S2Forum Extremist
    • Aug 2014
    • 1455
    • Country: United Kingdom

    #1

    Ignition switch playing up...

    hello all,

    Research suggests that by the time an ignition switch gets past its 20th birthday it is a likely culprit for all sorts of odd electrical gremlins. A couple of months ago my 26 year old CQ20v had a <very> momentary engine cut out on the way to work and to be honest it was so brief, had I not noticed the ABS light come on, i would have thought the jolt it was a bump in the road as it passed so quickly. Last week hard acceleration caused a slightly longer cut out but it bump started itself before i had the time to switch off and on again. Today however was a whole different kettle of fish...

    Accelerate onto M69 and there was a jolt, ABS light on, restarted on the key and carry on. No problems for next 10 miles then leaving the other end of the M69 onto the A46 the car dies, rev counter to zero, speedo needle up and down as though being switched on and off but all the dash lights on. Pull onto hard shoulder and restart with no problems. A little bit further down the A46 and accelerating away from a roundabout = total cut out and coast into a petrol station.

    No dashboard lights this time and no restart.

    An hour or so passed waiting for the AA and moments before the patrol turned up i heard a 'click' from a relay under the dash, ignition on and engine started perfectly.

    Definitely some weirdness going on here and I'm torn between it being the ignition switch or the aftermarket immobilizer as with key on the RUN position I noticed that ALL electrical functions such as lights, wipers, fan etc worked but just no supply to fuel pump or coil which is what the IM interrupts when working but with but with no LED showing it looked to all intents and purposes like it should have been deactivated. The click actually made the immobilizer LED come back on, it deactivated OK and from there the restart.


    I suspect that the ignition switch may supply power to the IM but without power (presumably a fail safe/secure mode) I wasn't able to turn it off and get going again.

    Switch part number 4A0 905 849 B seems to be the switch for all the coupes. How much are people currently paying for genuine Audi switches?

    I'll start with the switch as they don't last forever and see how it goes!
  • UrS4boy
    S2Forum Obsessed
    • Feb 2006
    • 11859
    • Country: Canada

    #2
    Ignition Switch replacement DIY

    This for a C4 but I think it will work reasonabley well for a B3 or B4:

    http://12v.org/urs/ReplacingTheIgnitionSwitch.pdf

    RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
    94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

    Comment

    • steve briance
      S2Forum Extremist
      • Aug 2014
      • 1455
      • Country: United Kingdom

      #3
      It does seem pretty straight forward!

      I reckon most of this applies, it is raining hard and getting dark now so not taken anything apart yet but from memory, I may need to go in from underneath rather than through the instrument aperture but otherwise it is a useful link - cheers!

      Comment

      • UrS4boy
        S2Forum Obsessed
        • Feb 2006
        • 11859
        • Country: Canada

        #4
        Originally posted by steve briance
        I reckon most of this applies, it is raining hard and getting dark now so not taken anything apart yet but from memory, I may need to go in from underneath rather than through the instrument aperture but otherwise it is a useful link - cheers!
        The screws that hold the switch into the lock cylinder carrier are on the top, not the bottom. You can just see where the red nail varnish was covering the top of the screws.

        http://audi.7zap.com/en/rdw/audi+cou.../905-905080/#1



        RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
        94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

        Comment

        • newsh
          S2Forum Obsessed
          • Aug 2003
          • 16226
          • Country: United Kingdom

          #5
          Through the instrument opening on the Coupe from memory.

          S2 Coupe 3B Project


          Ur quattro restoration

          S2 Avant

          Boost is the new rock and roll!
          sigpic

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          • steve briance
            S2Forum Extremist
            • Aug 2014
            • 1455
            • Country: United Kingdom

            #6
            that's good news then - it doesn't involve folding myself in half to get under the dashboard!

            Comment

            • GazzaG60
              S2Forum Freak
              • Mar 2007
              • 4133
              • Country: United Kingdom

              #7
              did this last week,

              fistly there are 2 switch types. look the same but different fitment to the keyway in the lock.

              if its an A code its a 95-97 with immob and a semi-circle. not available fro ecp or gsf or ebay.
              any other code b, c or no suffix is the ebay, ecp switch at 5-15 quid.

              check this first,

              its wheel off, clocks out. small watchmaker flatty, scratch paint and unscrew. remove and refit.

              Comment

              • 1781cc
                S2Forum Extremist
                • Nov 2011
                • 1253
                • Country: United Kingdom

                #8
                Did mine the other day using the guide, took about 20 minutes all in, really easy to do! TPS charge £45 for a new switch and the stock it in store

                Comment

                • GazzaG60
                  S2Forum Freak
                  • Mar 2007
                  • 4133
                  • Country: United Kingdom

                  #9
                  get mine from ebay. 7 quid from volksbits

                  Comment

                  • steve briance
                    S2Forum Extremist
                    • Aug 2014
                    • 1455
                    • Country: United Kingdom

                    #10
                    Gazza, mine will be pre immobiliser being a 1990 car so hopefully I can get an original one from TPS tomorrow but just out of interest, what brand did Volksbits send you? I've had stuff from them before and it has been respected brand named parts.

                    I hate intermittent electrical faults - i KNOW i need to fix something but at the moment, everything works and if it continues to after fitting a new switch, i will never know if it solved the problem!

                    cheers all

                    Comment

                    • mike74
                      S2Forum Maniac
                      • Apr 2014
                      • 615
                      • Country: Scotland

                      #11
                      Could also be the thermal fuse for the injectors etc. Replace with a normal 15a fuse. It resides underneath steering wheel and is coloured brown (from memory)

                      Comment

                      • steve briance
                        S2Forum Extremist
                        • Aug 2014
                        • 1455
                        • Country: United Kingdom

                        #12
                        TPS now charge £40.45 for an ignition switch and this evening i did the swap over.
                        It really is one of those refreshingly easy jobs that come along once every now and then and makes you think 'if only everything was this easy...'

                        pics show how the switch casing had cracked but I don't think this would necessarily affect operation as the cracking seems to be caused by the return spring. The crack propagates from the tail of the spring. Whether this causes some free play in the operating cam inside the switch who knows but a more likely cause of trouble is the state of the contacts. Corrosion on contacts for pin 15 mean route to earth is affected...

                        there didn't appear to be any issues with the wiring loom in the dash as with the instrument cluster out i started up and gave everything a wiggle to hopefully show up and intermittent breaks and there was nothing. Let's see how it goes!
                        Attached Files

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                        • UrS4boy
                          S2Forum Obsessed
                          • Feb 2006
                          • 11859
                          • Country: Canada

                          #13
                          That is the typical failure. Once that casing cracks, the return spring doesn't work properly and when you release the key from START, it may or may not (Likely NOT) return to the proper RUN position (and pin connections). More than once, a failed ignition switch has left the starter in the START position, even after then engine has started leading to overspinning the starter and starter failure.

                          RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
                          94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

                          Comment

                          • GazzaG60
                            S2Forum Freak
                            • Mar 2007
                            • 4133
                            • Country: United Kingdom

                            #14
                            thats the failure I had on both mine.

                            1990 is the no suffix or b switch.

                            not sure on volksbits part maker but at 7 quid it did the job. ill get a spare just in case for future. had a starter failure too. rebuilt a 5 speed starter into the nose of the 6 speed one. works a treat

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