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  • Cylinder Head Removal

    I'm going to be removing my cylinder head very soon.

    What parts do I need to buy to get it back together? What should be replaced while this is off?

    Is there a document (erwin or other) to show all torque settings?

    I have never taken a head off a car before so would like a dummies guide of do's and don'ts.

    Are 2 cylinder Head gaskets really a bad idea? Is there a thicker head gasket, off the shelf from anywhere else?

    Does anyone recommend anywhere for doing some headwork?

    Is it worth getting the RS2 Exhaust manifold ported and polished?

    cheers
    S2,RS2,S4 WB,RS4,S4 B8,RS6 C5,RS6 C6,R8

  • #2
    @ Doug Copy of PM sent your way m8!

    Right the Head Job!!

    Well, i was fitting a turbo and cam belt at the same time, but i basically I removed the front of the car to alow better access all round really, which took about and hour or so.

    I removed the Bumper, IC x member, IC, aux rad and slam pannal also the O/S bonnet catch slam pannel too. It can be done without removing that O/S slam pannel (that the head lamp secures to) but i did it for ease really so i could get to evrything and do the job right!.

    Then just went round removing obvious bits of pipes clips etc. Dont forget the vac pipe at the rear of the IM! I removed the head with both manifolds and turbo still attached, but took two people really to avoid dammaging the head face cos that lots pretty heavy!

    I only removed the exhaust bolts in the engine bay and did'nt bother with going down to the underside! Made it a little difficult to revove and refit the head but possible all the same!

    Quote from the Haynes manual "re-fitting is the oppsite to removal"

    With the whoe job i renewed the follwing:

    Cam Belt 054 109 119
    Cam belt idler 078 109 244 F (Required!!!!)
    Cam belt tensioner 054 109 242 (not required!!!)
    Water Pump 054 121 004 A (check number?) £42 aprox!
    Thermostat 069 121 113 £9.24
    Thermostat Seal N 901 368 02 £1.71
    All three drive belts.
    Belt V 034 260 849 12.5 x 912
    Belt V 034 260 849 E 12.5 x 1030
    Belt ribbed 034 903 137 B
    Crank bolt 034 105 229 A
    Turbo to EM bolts
    Turbo to down pipe bolts(Martyn sent me 3 of one type and an odd one! this odd one is 15mm socket opposed to 17mm or 19mm whatever the other three are. This one is for the akward lower turbo to down pipe nut!)
    Turbo to EM gasket
    Turbo to downpiep gasket
    2 wastegate bypass pipe gaskets.
    RS2 Head Gasket 034 103 383 AD
    Head Bolts 034 103 38J C

    The Water pump came with a seal from the dealers.
    The thermostat and seal (seperate) also came from the dealers.

    Double check all part numbers with Martyn first!!!!!!!

    The crank bolt was in good order and didnt need replacing but when i'd already bought it and it goes to 450 nm i though i may as well do it!

    I think i have a link to some tightening tourqes so ill have a look and dig it out! If you want owt else any questions or anything, just ask! Iam sure i can remember more than i've written but just not at the mo!

    Thanks Doug, and all the best of luck mate in your rebuild! What are you planning to do to fix the head? Heli-coil? or drilled and tapped to take bigger plugs??
    Money is everything! Second to Power of course!!! But money breeds power??

    Comment


    • #3
      Good list Glen, thats about it really. As for getting someone to do the work on the head, dunno any companies in your area mate. Porting the EM is a good idea, might be worth smoothing the inside to allow gases to get out faster?
      sigpic
      Tom C - www.rcmr.co.uk
      Audi UR Quattro
      Audi 100 C3 2.0 5 cyl 115ps
      Audi S2 - 07k engine project aiming for 800ps
      Audi B5 RS4 645ps 911nm

      Comment


      • #4
        Is it worth getting a set of exhaust studs as these can break? I don't want to end up waiting a week becasue of one silly stud or nut I don't have.

        I want to use a recommended place to do the work on the head.

        What about the nuts the hold the cams on are they one-use only?

        I'm hopefully getting some of the head studs that Steve and Mark are using - what was the deal withthe washer s and nuts again? And do you use the stud manufacturer torque figures or the audi torque figures?

        Is a new 7A Exhaust Cam a straight fit in? How much is one of these Martyn?
        S2,RS2,S4 WB,RS4,S4 B8,RS6 C5,RS6 C6,R8

        Comment


        • #5
          Doug those studs are well worth changing, i did mine when i renewed the manifold, they are known to break off when old Trust me
          Camshaft nuts are ok to re use, they are not very tight from memory
          Have a chat with SteveH about cams and rods etc.

          Hope it all goes well. Ask Mark if he will do the porting/polishing on your head, did you see his? It was the dogs danglers! Any engineering firm can helicoil the spark plugs hole mate. I would do it but im a bit far away!! And im not going up there this time of year. Cold enough down south.

          Hope it goes ok mate.
          sigpic
          Tom C - www.rcmr.co.uk
          Audi UR Quattro
          Audi 100 C3 2.0 5 cyl 115ps
          Audi S2 - 07k engine project aiming for 800ps
          Audi B5 RS4 645ps 911nm

          Comment


          • #6
            Doug,
            the 7a cam is a straight fit, i reused the nuts for the cam bearing caps, was told its not necessary to renew, dont lose any bearing caps mind, or you'll need a new head , each head is in-line bored so they aern't interchangable. you'll see that each cap has a notch/chamfer on one side, note which way round they are, think they all point to the intake side, i'll double check.
            i found it a lot easier than i thought, as long as you double/triple/quadruple check that youv'e got the 2 zero points on the cams lined up after youve got the chain on you'll be ok, when i did mine it looked lined up when i was tightening the cams down, after everything was tightened up it was one flamin' tooth out so had to strip it all off again
            good luck.

            Comment


            • #7
              I've already asked Mark - I don't think his missus would let him do another head :nana:

              Would like some advice on how to port and polish an exhaust manifold though?

              The guy at PTS showed us a helicoil and t-cert - the t-cert looks better, so will probably get 5 of those put in. I might as well look for a local place, if it is easy for these places to do then. The only problem I can see is that the flat mounting surface of the spark plug washer, on the head might be damaged?

              Any pros and cons of helicoils over t-certs?
              S2,RS2,S4 WB,RS4,S4 B8,RS6 C5,RS6 C6,R8

              Comment


              • #8
                Cheers Martin
                S2,RS2,S4 WB,RS4,S4 B8,RS6 C5,RS6 C6,R8

                Comment


                • #9
                  sorry i have nothing to add but i do have a couple of questions about a cylinder head
                  what does it do?
                  is it the thing with the inlet valves?
                  if the inlet valves Burn out does the whole f***ing thing need replacing and how the hell did i burn out inlet valves
                  cheers guys
                  skint but fast

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Basic are:
                    An engine is made of two bits, the bottom bit is the block and top is the head! (in between is the head gasket!!)

                    If you burnt out inlet valves then they are replaceable and a new head is not required!
                    Money is everything! Second to Power of course!!! But money breeds power??

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      cheers glen
                      thats good (not the s2) why do the valves burn out ,how do you do it and does that cause lack of compression
                      skint but fast

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Iv found time certs to be a better repair on such as spark plugs as they tend to work better with somthing that may be removed again try to get the fitter to fitt them with permanent locktite as ive known them to come out again (stay on the spark plug) have also known them to be fitted without removing the head.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Marty - I want to check what has happened to the thread that was ripped out as it wasn't on the spark plug - best to check the state of the piston and cylinder
                          S2,RS2,S4 WB,RS4,S4 B8,RS6 C5,RS6 C6,R8

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Doug,

                            My mate wrecked an Evo 5 engine with lost oil pressure, and the company that fixed it were Agra. They are in Dundee and have a website http://www.agra-eng.co.uk.

                            the Evo engine cost 4.5k to fix - hope yours is cheaper
                            Mike

                            http://www.s2-audi.co.uk

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by madshad
                              cheers glen
                              thats good (not the s2) why do the valves burn out ,how do you do it and does that cause lack of compression
                              Not had any experience with burnt out valves but my experience has shown that exhaust valves pit far more than the inlets, due to the temperature of the gases i expect!

                              Old cars that used to run on 4 star had to have new harder inlet valve seats fitted becasue they relied on the led from the 4 star to help lubricate the valve seats and unleaded obviously didn't have that lead in! It did have a lead substituet but not as good as the real thing! (only some old cars mind)

                              If any valve has burnt out then compression will be dramitically reduced and or completly eliminated. Becasue of the simple nature of the 4 stroke cycle engine! The engine relies on the valves being gas tight so it can compress the air in the cylinder! if theres a hole in the top then all the gas will just escape when any attemp to compress it is made! (just like drilling a hole in the side of a bike pump and wondering why your tyre aint goin up?)
                              Money is everything! Second to Power of course!!! But money breeds power??

                              Comment

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