removing dizzy - turning engine to mark?

[Nj]

i really was trying to test before performing any crazy work but alas being a newbie has paid its price. i'll test the coil, as you say and see where that takes me. It was my plan for the morning anyway. my haynes manual has some reference to testing it but i'll go for the smj method.

How did SteveH get the remnants of the pin out by the way? And what did he replace it with? I see there were suggestions on that post but i'd imagine you can order a replacement pin surely? Did he have to remove the engine? I'm slightly calmer if you say it wasn't as big an issue as changing a dizzy (tho i'm an expert at this now) but I hope I don't have to take the engine right out.

regarding the "expert" diagnosis - the whole idea was to avoid all this amateur messing about but turns out he was an imbecile. When i finally get it fixed i'll be heading over to see him to see if he wants to give me a refund, on account of him being incompetent and all.

cheers for your wisdom on this.
Nj

[Nj]

ah. hang on. you meant that taking out the starter is easier than changing a dizzy... not the actual pin replacement. doh!

[Knight Rider S4]

Alrite still at it i see ........i am off on monday thru the day could pop up and um and ah at it for you if you want

[Nj]

aww damn it. that's the 2nd time you've offered and again i'll be at work. thanks mate. if i'm still at it on the 28th i'll be off work and throwing spanners about if you want to nip down?
cheers

[Nj]

alrighty. think I got vagcom running ok now. and got the results below. I thought this was telling me I have a hall sensor problem? Which is why I changed the dizzy. I'm now thinking i better check the pin on the flywheel.
I stuck an LED across pins 2 and 3 of the hall sensor and got a flash every 2nd turn. I just stuck an LED across pins 1 and 15 on the coil (as per smj website) but not getting a flash.
Think I should take out the starter to check the flywheel pin. I can't think of anything else to do now.



VAG-COM Version: Release 409.1-US


Chassis Type: 8C - Audi 80 B4
Scan: 01,02,03,08,15,25,26

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine
Controller: 895 907 404
Component: MOTOR PMC 1
Coding: 0261200484
Shop #: 1267356530
1 Fault Found:
00515 - Camshaft Position (Hall) Sensor (G40)
04-10 - Mechanical Malfunction - Intermittent
Readiness: N/A

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Skipping Address 15-Airbags

End --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[s2dude]

check the pin
if its missing get thinking of someone who has decent engineering skills and a welder and get them round!. You could then maybe use the new pin, grind it down slightly to account for the height difference of the broken pin stub, and weld it in place.
Should be strong enough with a good weld?!

[Nj]

I like your thinking mate. are talking engine out for this? other posts seem to suggest it ain't easy to get at. it's well beyond me. but everything was well beyond me a few weekas ago so hey.. best I get stuck in..

[s2dude]

Get cracking on with checking if its the pin first!! and you can then look at access possibilities.
Remove the starter..then take all spark plugs out, turn the engine over by turning the crank bolt until you can clearly see through the hole if the pin is in place or has sheared off

if it has, I couldnt say to be honest if it can be repaired with the engine in as I have never tried. But looking at the same location on my car I think an in situ repair would be possible, but quite tricky

I think what I would do *if the pin was bust* is firstly find out from someone who has a flywheel out of the car what the projection of the pin should be from the surface.

Check the depth of the hole with the broken pin piece in, and then file/cut/ etc the new pin so it will seat in the hole and project the right height.
If a welder cant fit in there, i would use JB weld and provided you give it proper time to set...its absolutely awesome stuff (chemical weld in a tube) and you may be sorted

[Nj]

i know the stuff mate. many moons ago i worked in a hardware shop and the rep came round to show us the stuff. he glued 2 valves together and later we tried to get them apart with a vice and a very big hammer. bent the valves but couldn't get them apart. amazing stuff.

being a total amateur i'll need to find the starter first, then get it out for a look. if there's no pin i'll see about the welding shenanigans.

that which doesn't kill us only makes us stronger... apparently. hope it doesn't kill me

[Dubbedup]

Dude, Was going to send you a text but just incase the wee man is sleeping..

******** mate, total nightmare.

S2Dude has a good point JB weld the pin back on is a good idea. Rember I have a MIG welder and we could drill and weld a new pin back on but that will be an engine out jobbie...

Mail you in the morning.

[Nj]

sounds like a plan mate (cue us two accidentally welding the flywheel to the IM or something)
we should video it cos it's a dead cert we'll get a couple of quid off beadle or whoever does the show these days when you set me on fire.

first thing's pulling the starter out and turning the engine over so i can see if it is the pin.
if it isn't then i'm calling in the local priest to have a crack at an exorcism.

[Nj]

alrighty - got the bottom nut off the starter. nut came off and bolt slid back a bit. But the top bolt is going to be a buggr to get off. there's no nut - the bracket seems to be threaded and the bolt goes through from behind (gearbox side).
I had a go at getting it loose before it got too dark to see what the hell I was doing. I have to reach down behind the turbo and the EM to get at it. Is there a recommended way to attack it? Just doesn't seem to be a whole lot of room to get leverage on my ratchet.
All this is just to get the starter off to see if the pin is still attached to the flywheel. Seems a bit mental but hey ho, there will be a lot more than that coming out if the pin is sheared off.

[Nj]

Good news - Flywheel pin is still intact
Bad news - Got a dizzy off Sal (cheers Sal ) but this hasn't resolved my issue.
Time to leave it into the professionals I fear.

Just before I do - is there any other earth strap I should check and clean up, bar the one that runs from the bottom of the engine to the chassis (just under the starter)?

[twoqu]

If you are 100% sure the pin is intact, the pin that faces you when looking into the starter motor aperature, not the other pins on the otherside of the flywheel, then we can work forward from there.
It needs all the signals to switch the coil. Thats the Hall sender, RPM and Timing. So if the mechanical part, the pin and flywheel teeth are intact, the only other components between the ecu are the timing/rpm senders. I'm not sure if you are not mentioning the rpm sensor fault that usually comes up when the car isn't running or not getting it with Vagcom
Think we have eliminated the ecu as that worked on another vehicle. Has the correct dizzy eliminated the hall sender fault code? Have you double checked its installed correctly in respect to the timing marks.
Rather than splash out on new sensors, perhaps you can try yours on the same persons car that you tried the ecu on, to try and eliminate those.
Obviously if the coil isn't being switched and everything has been tested and eliminated and accurately positioned, then you need to look at any additions to the vehicle in terms of aftermarket immos/alarms.
Don't give up yet! I know it frustrating, but you are getting a good education if nothing else.

[Nj]

Don't give up yet! I know it frustrating, but you are getting a good education if nothing else.

That's very true mate, and in a kind of bizarre way i'm enjoying it. I would just be enjoying it a bit more if the car started.
the pin facing into the starter is definitely intact (phew) so at least that's a good sign. Before replacing the sensors I'm going to have someone turn the ignition while I slowly turn the distributor body. I'm sure I had the timing marks lighned up to TDC before I put the dizzy in so i'm inclined to think it must be something i've done otherwise.

I'll run vagcom again later since i've put in a different dizzy and see if I still get the hall sender fault. The fact that it says intermittent mechanical fault is suggesting to me that it's me that's the issue and not the hall sender.

I'll try turning the dizzy body and run vagcom again and let you know how it goes.

cheers
Nj