Rod Weight

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  • HPmuirt
    S2Forum April Fool
    • Apr 2005
    • 3014
    • Home: United Kingdom Current: England

    #16
    Just fishing for further info as I have asked similar questions before, but it would be good to get definitive weights, answers and opinions in a single thread....

    1. What have people weighed OEM rods at?

    2. What have people weighed Pauter rods at?

    3. At what weight saving, if any, will we see a noticeable improvement in pickup with a mid-performance engine (300-400BHP)?

    4. Is there a max/min rod weight for the crank weight to allow perfect balancing? By that I mean, if you have your crank lightened, does it bring the ideal max rod weight below the weight of some rods?

    5. At what performance level is it worth putting titanium rods in, or is it worth putting them in anyway if you are prepared to throw big bucks at the engine?

    6. I had assumed that Pauters were the rods of choice. Are they worth the extra cost?

    7. Is there a recommended piston upgrade for further weight saving, or do most only change pistons when changing pin size or bore size?

    These and many more inane questions available at vvvvvv.i-am-an-idiot.co.ck

    Cheers n

    Si
    95 ABY S2 Coupe - Ragusa Green
    Subtle mods here and there


    2011 A5 3.0 TDi - Lava Grey
    With every option available (except a towball)

    Comment

    • Rusty
      Super Moderator
      • Jun 2004
      • 18953
      • Country: United Kingdom

      #17
      This time Si we're on the same wavelength!
      Cheers'en, AndyC
      1994 ABY Coupe - Projekt Alpinweiss

      Comment

      • Pembo
        S2Forum Addict
        • Aug 2004
        • 295
        • Country: United Kingdom

        #18
        Originally posted by Andy_Casey
        Pembo, was that not the 3B though? ABY rods are ok for 400ftlbs. If i go for a bigger turbo then I need to do some re-balancing for a new clutch anyway so not too worried.
        Engine was standard AAN (thought this was stronger but all part numbers seem to be the same!) with a few mods like Piper cams, head ported and polished, alloy flywheel and front pulley. Mapping was done by MRC Tuning on the road and that has given it some large torques!! (When was the North West Rolling Road day?) I thought the engine would be OK running a 34mm restrictor but obviously not.

        It will now have Scat rods (balanced both ends! and individual equal), balanced crank, competition mains and big ends, balanced pistons, balanced aluminium flywheel, balanced front aluminium pulley and balanced clutch. This is known as 'zero balancing'.

        See you all in Hinkley (Rally of the Midlands) on 20th and 21st June. Still need a navigator!
        sigpic
        Pembo
        quattro - Original 4WD rallying
        Rally Car photos

        Comment

        • Rusty
          Super Moderator
          • Jun 2004
          • 18953
          • Country: United Kingdom

          #19
          Oh, and with a restrictor too, what boost are you running and max RPM?
          Cheers'en, AndyC
          1994 ABY Coupe - Projekt Alpinweiss

          Comment

          • S2central.net
            Retired OG Mod
            • Jul 2003
            • 16590
            • Country: Northern Ireland

            #20
            I thought Pembos blew up cos it was a 3B and therefore suffered the fate of Paschen's law - mahoosive spark jump in the dissy causing pre-ignition and catastrophic shock waves.

            I have no idea how a K24 turbo can generate enough torque to do destructive damage like that to stock rods... Unless there is a sneaky bottle of N20 disguised as a fire extinguisher in that car.

            The 3B and ABY rods are well up for the job in terms of torque, but there might be a benefit in using forged ones if the reduced mass is significant.

            From what I remember, every gram of weight saved on ROTATING mass is actually multiplied by a factor relating to distance from the centre of rotation and this results in lower drivetrain losses as a result => more power at the wheels and a more freely revving lil engine into the bargain.
            Paul Nugent
            Webmaster http://S2central.net
            Administrator http://S2forum.com

            1994 S2 Coupe ABY - aka Project Lazarus
            2001 A6 allroad 2.5TDi - family tank
            2003 S4 Avant 4.2 V8 - daily burble

            Purveyor of HomeFries and Exclusive agent for Samco hose kits (S2/RS2)

            There are only 10 kinds of people that understand binary - those that do, and those that don't

            Comment

            • Rusty
              Super Moderator
              • Jun 2004
              • 18953
              • Country: United Kingdom

              #21
              Hence my original question as I would have shelled out for rods if they were lighter than original and the strength would have been a bonus. Need to talk to an engine builder to get some prices.
              Cheers'en, AndyC
              1994 ABY Coupe - Projekt Alpinweiss

              Comment

              • Flat on my back
                S2Forum Fiend
                • Jan 2007
                • 2449
                • Country: United Kingdom

                #22
                So...

                du want me ta measure me rods tu'mura or wot...
                Carlos.

                On the look out for less bits for my s2 saloon project. Now supporting myself by shooting for my food. www.airgunforum.co.uk

                Comment

                • Pembo
                  S2Forum Addict
                  • Aug 2004
                  • 295
                  • Country: United Kingdom

                  #23
                  Originally posted by Andy_Casey
                  Oh, and with a restrictor too, what boost are you running and max RPM?
                  Was using a 1.5 bar boost gauge and the needle spent a lot of time against the stop. Just bought a 2.5 bar boost gauge.

                  Never use max RPM because of the restrictor so alway change at about 6000 rpm. Masses of torque and not too bad for power either!
                  sigpic
                  Pembo
                  quattro - Original 4WD rallying
                  Rally Car photos

                  Comment

                  • Rusty
                    Super Moderator
                    • Jun 2004
                    • 18953
                    • Country: United Kingdom

                    #24
                    Ah, 2+ bar on a k24 is pretty amusing!

                    Carlos, any more data is gratefully recieved. Scats again?
                    Cheers'en, AndyC
                    1994 ABY Coupe - Projekt Alpinweiss

                    Comment

                    • Flat on my back
                      S2Forum Fiend
                      • Jan 2007
                      • 2449
                      • Country: United Kingdom

                      #25
                      Scat rods.

                      Standard rods, 144mm, 0.787, 1.992 with ARP 2000 bolts.

                      Big end weight 408
                      Small end weight 173

                      Rod 1-581gms
                      Rod 2-582gms
                      Rod 3-582gms
                      Rod 4-582gms
                      Rod 5-582gms

                      Rods wiped clean but need a full dip really.
                      Carlos.

                      On the look out for less bits for my s2 saloon project. Now supporting myself by shooting for my food. www.airgunforum.co.uk

                      Comment

                      • Rusty
                        Super Moderator
                        • Jun 2004
                        • 18953
                        • Country: United Kingdom

                        #26
                        Thanks Carlos, that's great.

                        Jade reported 580g, was that standard rods or other?

                        What are the weight of the Scat rods then?
                        Cheers'en, AndyC
                        1994 ABY Coupe - Projekt Alpinweiss

                        Comment

                        • Jamo
                          Retired OG Mod
                          • Mar 2004
                          • 21750
                          • Country: United Kingdom

                          #27
                          Originally posted by Pembo
                          It will now have Scat rods (balanced both ends! and individual equal), balanced crank, competition mains and big ends, balanced pistons, balanced aluminium flywheel, balanced front aluminium pulley and balanced clutch. This is known as 'zero balancing'.
                          Was everything Zero balanced? As the audi manual states it should be 50% balance?

                          I know this is how mine was done via Aelred.

                          Comment

                          • S2central.net
                            Retired OG Mod
                            • Jul 2003
                            • 16590
                            • Country: Northern Ireland

                            #28
                            Jamo - what Audi manual explicitly states that ?
                            Paul Nugent
                            Webmaster http://S2central.net
                            Administrator http://S2forum.com

                            1994 S2 Coupe ABY - aka Project Lazarus
                            2001 A6 allroad 2.5TDi - family tank
                            2003 S4 Avant 4.2 V8 - daily burble

                            Purveyor of HomeFries and Exclusive agent for Samco hose kits (S2/RS2)

                            There are only 10 kinds of people that understand binary - those that do, and those that don't

                            Comment

                            • Flat on my back
                              S2Forum Fiend
                              • Jan 2007
                              • 2449
                              • Country: United Kingdom

                              #29
                              Andy...sorry

                              those were the the Scat rod weights...but for standard rod replacement...no bigger wrist pins or funny lenghts.

                              Did that clear things.
                              Carlos.

                              On the look out for less bits for my s2 saloon project. Now supporting myself by shooting for my food. www.airgunforum.co.uk

                              Comment

                              • Rusty
                                Super Moderator
                                • Jun 2004
                                • 18953
                                • Country: United Kingdom

                                #30
                                Ah ok, cheers. Just need the weight of a standard rod to compare that to now.
                                Cheers'en, AndyC
                                1994 ABY Coupe - Projekt Alpinweiss

                                Comment

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