New Cambelt now won't start?

[Condor]

Hi all, took my 3b in to garage to have the cambelt changed, had a phone call from the mechanic he said your car's all put back together now however it will not start, he said it turns over but there's no spark? has anyone got any ideas what maybe causing this problem?the distributor gear was replaced a couple of years back when the nylon one failed so shouldn't be that causing the problem, the car was running fine before this latest problem.
Things aren't going too well as there was a muck up with the water pump apparently it was put on back order then when it did arrive almost a week after it was ordered by the garage guess what it was the wrong one!!! now my lovely S2 won't start, I'm begining to wish I'd got all the parts needed for the job beforehand, I thought there would not be any problems as the same garage/mechanic renewed the cambelt etc when I bought the car almost 8years ago now.
I take it it's possible to plug the car into diagnostic machine am I right?
Thanks Condor,,,

[UrS4boy]

You can still pull the diagnostic codes. *My* fear would be that they have b*ggered the timing of the cam and the crank and/or the 3B distributor and are potentially banging the intake valves with the pistons. They need to confirm the proper cam belt to crankshaft timing and then make sure that the distributor is actually going around when they are cranking the engine, i.e. have a look with the distributor cap off.

[Sleeper_Avant]

obviousley your mechanic knows to check its timed by looking at the dizzy...........?

surely theve turned it over by hand to make sure theres no contact first, but get them to compression test it, then do a leak test

i take it its got plenty fuel in lol

[macspring]

I know this is of no help, but you really can’t beat giving these cars to people who work on them very regularly, ( if you can’t do it yourself ), even if they are much further away than you’d like. Especially with the replacement of timing belts, and the bottom toothed cog on the end of the crank.

As I said, no help whatsoever in your present quandary.

Wishing you good luck in resolving it speedily and easily.

...

[Jamo]

http://www.rcmr.co.uk/ Audiman knows his sh*t

In terms of this sounds like the timing is way off

[Jenks]

They need to confirm the proper cam belt to crankshaft timing

Using the flywheel mark not the crank pulley mark as this can be out if the outer part of the harmonic damper has slipped. Phil Payne has highlighted this either on here, classic audi or quattro forum and a good friend of mine has fallen foul of this problem with two engines in the same car in quick succession as the pulley was transferred to the replacement engine.

That said don't get stuck on one train of thought as it could be a complete coincidence and not related to the cambelt swap at all.

[Condor]

Still not got it running

Hi All, firstly thankyou to everyone who replied to my thread, well as I've not had a phonecall from my garage for almost a week I decided to call them today, the boss said they still haven't got my S2 to start, one of the fault codes suggested the ecu had a fault so they sent it to be tested and it was ok, he said they are at a loss on what to try next and they are open to any ideas I may have, he says there is no spark and no injection signal, he says the fuel pump is running.
Could it possibly be the flywheel pin broken off?
what else can I suggest as I am quite shocked that the problem has not been tracked and sorted by now, I'm also concerned at what this is going to cost!! as I've only bugeted for the cambelt change.
Your suggestions will be more than welcomed..
Thanks Condor

[Monkeymagic]

It shouldn't cost you any more than than the agreed cost of the cambelt change.
I run a VAG garage and at times despite every effort to avoid problems they do arise. However within reason I do not expect the customer to foot the bill.
Going back to your problem though have the garage run a compression check and triple checked their timing of the belt/ignition timing.
Going back to basics and I do not claim to be an expert on S2's but there are two reasons why an engine wont fire. No spark/no fuel or both.
I'm not knocking the garage because I know how difficult it can be at times, but a week with no contact is getting emabarrassing

[Tonks4x4]

Remove the plastic cover off the fuel pump relay in position 10 of the fuse box plug the relay back in without the cover.
Crank it over on the key, if it pulls the relay in on cranking then the flywheel pin is intact.

Next pull a plug lead and stick a spark plug in, crank it see if you have spark.

If both of these are good then they have set the timing wrong

[prj]

The relay gets activated off of engine speed sensor afaik. The pin is TDC signal.
Pretty sure Paul tested it on the bench.

I am pretty sure the timing is out, and ECU comes up with hall sensor fault.

[simon20vq]

I was taught if something don't work and it was fine before go back to what you just did! They have changed the cam belt so only touched the front of the car. Must be timing. They are checking the right timing mark on the crank pully? Have they put a 147 toothed belt on and not an aby 151 toothed belt!

[newsh]

You shouldn't use the crank pulley mark to set the timing, you have to use the "0" mark in the bell housing window.

They need to take the dizzy cover off and check the timing marks in there too. Flywheel, cams and dizzy need to be spot on. Make sure they used the crankshaft locking tool and torqued corrrectly, not used a rattle gun!

[Condor]

Up & running once more.

Hi All, well boys & girls after speaking to my garage late yesterday afternoon I got a phone call not long after 10am this morning with the good news that my luvly S2 is alive once more.
The explanation was ......wait for it.......the timing was out, the mechanic rechecked the timing yet again and decided to move the distributor a smidgen and hey presto the engine came to life, when I collected my car this afternoon I spoke to the mechanic who did the cambelt job,(I think he did it 8yrs ago for me) he said on the osciloscope everything looked spot on, but to try something to get the engine running he decided to tweek the dizzy a very very small amount, he couldn't believe the very small amount by which he moved it would make a difference but it did, "we live and learn".

By the way the crank pulley was inspected and given the all clear so not replaced.
A big thankyou to everyone here who offered advice, UrS4boy,Sleeper Avant,macspring,Jamo,Jenks,Monkeymagic,Tonks4x4,pr j,Simon20vq,and last but certainlt not least newsh cheers chaps

[UrS4boy]

Yippee!

[driftin jo]

Thats all well and good, BUT, why if you changed the timing belt did you have to move the dizzy to get it to start ?
This suggest that the belt is one or more teeth from where it was before you changed it.
The reason you only had to move the dizzy a tiny bit is because the hall sender signal (in the dizzy on your car) has to line up in time with the flywheel timing pin, if it does not fall in the window the ECU can't start the engine.

As you don't move the dizzy during a cam belt change I would say you cam timing is out, either that or it was out before the belt was changed and someone in the past had adjusted the dizzy to compensate for this.

Whatever way you look at this the timing is not as it was before the belt change.
I would have someone who knows tom have a look at you timing and verify that it correct.