ABY and vcds

[bernsaudi]

Hello, I'm trying to chase a flatspot and have a 00561 adaptation mul limit not reached,
I have plugged in the vcds but am unsure what facility it has with my car or what measuring blocks I should bring up to look at o2 voltage, maf etc, any help will be greatly appreciated

[Error404]

AFRs out of trim range
First step is boost leak test and also check fuel delivery is correct I.e. Injectors and FPR working correctly.

[bernsaudi]

I just put these injectors in, any idea what version they are? I cant remember what I was told..

[S2central.net]

Need to see the Bosch number - it's a 9 or 10 digit starting with 0

[UrS4boy]

00561 and G70 MAF info

Hello, I'm trying to chase a flatspot and have a 00561 adaptation mul limit not reached

00561 Blink code: 2413

Mixture adaptation

-Adaptation limit
(multiplicative)
exceeded
-Adaptation limit
(multiplicative) not
reached
-Adaptation limit
(additive) exceeded
-Adaptation limit
(additive) not reached

Fuel system pressure too low or too high
-Failure of spark plugs, ignition coils
and ignition output stages
-Ingress of air to G70
-Leak in exhaust system up to catalyst
-Incorrect signal from air mass meter G70

G70 Mass Air Flow (MAF) sensor info:

http://forums.quattroworld.com/s4s6/msgs/20442.phtml

[bernsaudi]

Thanks all, the only codes visible on the injectors are:
MJY100460
D3184GB

I put the above set in as a replacement for red collar injectors:
MJY10023

I didn't write the other number down.

Is there a reading on vcds that gives me fuel pressure and injector duty?

Cheers!
p.s i must add that it is pulling like a train once I push the pedal past 60% all the way up.

[S2central.net]

OE diagnostics will tell you some useful information (injector opening times - not duty cycle), but unless you have a known good reference point to work from they won't tell you much running such aftermarket injectors. What spec are they supposed to be - i.e. what is your ECU setup for ?

OE diagnostics will not tell you fuel pressure, duty cycle, boost pressure or MAF voltage - annoying but true.

The Moronic ECU will try to adapt fuelling within its programmed limits of plus or minus the target AFR at any given load point (determined by MAF signal)... This is closed-loop mode.
Once load goes above a certain point (also programmable) the ECU will stop trying to adapt and just use the injector opening times which are driven directly by the fuel tables... i.e open-loop mode.

At a guess I would say your injectors are too rich for what the ECU expects if its running nice and rich (maybe too rich) when you load it up... then in closed loop mode, no matter how much it tries to back off the fuelling to adapt for lower AFR it fails to stay within limits.

All that said - if the injectors are correct for the ECU, then you are looking at a boost leak, fuel pressure regulator problem of a bad MAF.

[andy10v]

Thanks all, the only codes visible on the injectors are:
MJY100460
D3184GB

I put the above set in as a replacement for red collar injectors:
MJY10023

A quick google shows

MJY100460 480cc

MJY10023 380cc

[S2central.net]

just slightly different then !!!!!

[bernsaudi]

Morning, what cc should I have for 380hp? Both of these seem low in what I've read so far. Also when it comes to fuel pressure should I keep the stock 3.8 bar or move up to 4 or even 5 bar?
The 380 cc one came to me with a 1.9 bar chipset, the second set (460cc) came with a live map left at 'about' 360hp. ..

I put the 460's in and now have a flatspot.

[UrS4boy]

OE 20VT Fuel Injector Info (with link to Fuel Pressure Regulator info)

Morning, what cc should I have for 380hp? Both of these seem low in what I've read so far. Also when it comes to fuel pressure should I keep the stock 3.8 bar or move up to 4 or even 5 bar?

Stock AAN/ABY injectors with a 4 Bar Fuel Pressure regulator are good for about 280 hp max. ADU injectors with a 4 Bar Fuel Pressure regulator are good for a max of about 380 hp. Fuel injector nominal flow rates are measured at 3 Bar.

AAN and ABY: Audi PN 034 906 031 B, Bosch PN: 0 280 150 951, flow:
280 cc/ min @ 3.0 bar (= about 26.7 lb/hr at SG = 0.72)
315 cc/ min @ 3.8 bar
323 cc/ min @ 4.0 bar (AAN and ABY use a 4.0 Bar nominal FPR*)
361 cc/ min @ 5.0 bar

ADU: Audi PN 034 906 031 F, Bosch PN: 0 280 150 984, flow:
360 cc/ min @ 3.0 bar (= about 34.3 lb/hr at SG = 0.72)
405 cc/ min @ 3.8 bar (the ADU uses a 3.8 Bar nominal FPR*)
416 cc/ min @ 4.0 bar
465 cc/ min @ 5.0 bar

REFERENCE: OE 20VT Fuel Injector Info (with link to Fuel Pressure Regulator info):

http://forums.quattroworld.com/s4s6/msgs/20441.phtml

[S2central.net]

Morning, what cc should I have for 380hp? Both of these seem low in what I've read so far. Also when it comes to fuel pressure should I keep the stock 3.8 bar or move up to 4 or even 5 bar?
The 380 cc one came to me with a 1.9 bar chipset, the second set (460cc) came with a live map left at 'about' 360hp. ..

I put the 460's in and now have a flatspot.

Moronic tuning doesn't work like that... The ECU is configured with a bunch of parameters that align to the injectors and FPR on the car. If the ECU's view of that is different from reality then you will have problems.

380hp is pretty much the limit for 360cc injectors at approx 4bar in our 5-cyl motors.

I would need to see the motor chip contents to discover what the ECU expects. Did the previous tuner setup injector latency correctly for these components ?

[bernsaudi]

so i think my penny has dropped. I had a standard fuel pressure regulator on (3.8) with the 360cc injectors. I have had a look and the regulator I have fitted at the same time as the 460cc injectors is not a 4 bar. it is a 5 bar...didn't notice.
I will change the fpr back to the stock one tomorrow and report what change has occurred.

[UrS4boy]

so i think my penny has dropped. I had a standard fuel pressure regulator on (3.8) with the 360cc injectors. I have had a look and the regulator I have fitted at the same time as the 460cc injectors is not a 4 bar. it is a 5 bar...didn't notice. I will change the fpr back to the stock one tomorrow and report what change has occurred.

Technically there is nothing wrong with a 5 Bar Fuel pressure regulator as long as:

a) you software is aware of this, i.e. the tuning is geared to the higher pressures, i.e. more fuel per squirt

b) you have a big enough/strong enough fuel pump to provide 7 bar pressure, i.e. 5 bar plus the additional 2 bar or so boost. That is not possible with a stock fuel pump and might not even be possible with a Bosch 044 pump.

[andy10v]

380cc at 3 bar will be about

427cc at 3.8 bar
439cc at 4 bar
490cc at 5 bar

480cc at 3 bar will be about

539cc at 3.8 bar
554cc at 4 bar
619cc at 5 bar