80tq: 516whp

[ottawa coupe]

500+whp....dude, you just blew my mind

[JSHADZI]

I bet his answer will be that he'll stick with it as long as it's not a restriction. Once it becomes the bottleneck, then it would get addressed. Am I right, Javad?

That is correct...I hear so many people talking about the need for a better IM w/o citing any good reasons...guess we still don't have any yet??

[auditude]

That is correct...I hear so many people talking about the need for a better IM w/o citing any good reasons...guess we still don't have any yet??

I think the "FMTB" intake manifolds probably help more with throttle response than they do ultimate power levels. They can fit the available space better, after moving stuff around, and don't require the intake to go past the hot turbo, but obviously those issues don't preclude making big power using them.

I have heard people say the AAN type IM might not flow as well to cylinder 1 tho'.

[sorens2]

My BOV had a stiff spring when I bought it. Replaced it to a much softer on. But the lag is huge now...

Søren S2

[JSHADZI]

I think the "FMTB" intake manifolds probably help more with throttle response than they do ultimate power levels. They can fit the available space better, after moving stuff around, and don't require the intake to go past the hot turbo, but obviously those issues don't preclude making big power using them.

I have heard people say the AAN type IM might not flow as well to cylinder 1 tho'.

Agreed about the packaging concerns, no argument there, that's not what I was addressing.

With that said, I haven't seen any conclusive evidence to show actual throttle response is improved, I consider that more a theory than anything, anyone have conclusive evidence?

[JSHADZI]

My BOV had a stiff spring when I bought it. Replaced it to a much softer on. But the lag is huge now...

Søren S2

Well, it sounds like your valve is opening under boost? That is not correct, if there is pressure to the top side of the valve it should not open prematurely.

[sorens2]

It doesn´t open until I lift off the trottle. Car pulls as always and there is no leaking sound. And it makes that nice whhooosss sound as it should. Still lots of lag. Used to have a small Bailey. Worked ok.

Søren S2

[auditude]

Agreed about the packaging concerns, no argument there, that's not what I was addressing.

With that said, I haven't seen any conclusive evidence to show actual throttle response is improved, I consider that more a theory than anything, anyone have conclusive evidence?

Yeah, no argument here either. I have a FMTB style IM because at the time I didn't have any regular ones. Now that I have it, I'll use it (someday, that is!).

On the throttle response thing, I think some folks on here have reported it being improved after hacking and rewelding an AAN type IM into the (MTM/SQ style) FMTB configuration.

I'm kinda curious what factors influence throttle response. It seems like decreasing the distance between the TB and the turbo might help, but what are the influences on throttle response? (just a general question for whoever)

[audiman]

We have proved that the FMTB IM reduces the revs that the turbo hits in, but only by about 4-500rpm.

Javad, great figures dude. Would be worth doing a back pressure test IMO too. I used to run a 2.5" DP, but that casued the car to pink at about 5k, then i changed to 3" DP and the pinking was gone, this was because the gases could just get out faster (less back pressure). Ask Mihnea, as you know he does my mapping.

I also run the stock 3B manifold and it ISNT a restriction

[audiman]

****** i meant to ask what the part number was on the plugs that you are using and the gap on them. Im getting the odd misfire with the original AAN bosch plugs, it might be the coil dying, but if you found misfire probs then it could be the plugs causing it.

[JSHADZI]

Yeah, no argument here either. I have a FMTB style IM because at the time I didn't have any regular ones. Now that I have it, I'll use it (someday, that is!).

On the throttle response thing, I think some folks on here have reported it being improved after hacking and rewelding an AAN type IM into the (MTM/SQ style) FMTB configuration.

I'm kinda curious what factors influence throttle response. It seems like decreasing the distance between the TB and the turbo might help, but what are the influences on throttle response? (just a general question for whoever)

Most of the time when I see someone upgrade their IM, it comes will all sorts of other upgrades at the same time, I'd love to see someone who did this experimentally, I plan on doing this eventually.

Factors that I've found increase response in turbo applications:

-free flowing airfilter and inlet tract
-smaller turbo
-cams w/o any overlap
-free flowing cylinder head
-free flowing exhaust

[JSHADZI]

****** i meant to ask what the part number was on the plugs that you are using and the gap on them. Im getting the odd misfire with the original AAN bosch plugs, it might be the coil dying, but if you found misfire probs then it could be the plugs causing it.

Can't remember off the top of my head, but the standard 2.3l 20v plug, code 7A, tri-electrode, don't need gapping.

[audiman]

The other thing that i noticed that improved response was to move the MAF (if fitted) to the pressure side of things. But wouldnt recommend doing it, unless you have to.

[audiman]

F6DTC in BOSCH

[JSHADZI]

We have proved that the FMTB IM reduces the revs that the turbo hits in, but only by about 4-500rpm.

Great! Do you have any documentation you used to come to your conclusion? I'd love to see what you used for evaluation (not that I don't believe you, but that I may come to the same conclusion as well ).