2871R goes rather nicely...

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  • S2central.net
    Retired OG Mod
    • Jul 2003
    • 16590
    • Country: Northern Ireland

    #1

    2871R goes rather nicely...

    A picture speaks a thousand words - See attached GTech results

    Makes one big lump of UrS4 Avant go rather swiftly... courtesy of some real-time mapping today - bit frustrated by a dodgy MAF which wasted some time, but boy did a replacement make a difference.

    We didn't want to do lots of launches - this was the 1st one - not enough road for the full 1/4 mile but thats life. A subsequent one didn't hook up as well and yielded a bit slower.

    Needs a bit more fettling in real-time... To cut a long story short, my software needs some more bells and whistles to make things as easy as OLS in real-time mode. For the time being - there's quite a lot of trial error to zoom into the desired points. But I'm so glad not to have to do umpteen chip swaps anymore...

    Produces 1.5bar boost from 3000 (dunno boost threshold - but its good and low)
    Maxing about 1.7bar from 4500-5500
    Tailing off to 1.5bar at the redline

    This is NOT a laggy machine at all - very tractable and progressive.

    The real max torque figures will be higher than those shown - this launch data gave us power & torque in 3rd gear... Loading it up in 4th or higher from 2000rpm would yield higher numbers - we just didn't do them.

    So here's the highlights :

    0-60 in 4.2s and onto 100 in less than 10s
    367bhp - nett horsepower at the wheels (circa 5900)
    339ftlbs - 450Nm (~5000rpm)

    Pretty sure this turbo will go even higher boost - tried a little for that, but it feels like a bigger WG spring is going to be needed to counteract the WG creep. That or some funky twin port modulation on the WG.

    Not sure I'd want to go more boost on it without a stronger bottom end - this thing is stock except for the bigger turbo, EM and injectors... Stock bottom end, stock head & cams... Stock airbox... Only other extra is a mighty big intercooler which keeps air temps in control. Under some quite strenuous prolonged load tests I saw IAT of 60 degree celsius. No way the stock IC would cope with this. Oh and it has an uprated clutch - hybrid of Sachs and Spec from memory.

    I haven't done any other calculations based on GTech results but this must be into 430bhp territory (assuming 15% drivetrain losses).

    This kind of power in an S2 or UR would be even more amazing - Des is building a UR on a 20VT engine with a 3071R turbo - I am going to need extra pairs of kaks to ride shotgun in that thing. It'll be almost 700kg lighter for a start.

    Enough for now...
    Attached Files
    Paul Nugent
    Webmaster http://S2central.net
    Administrator http://S2forum.com

    1994 S2 Coupe ABY - aka Project Lazarus
    2001 A6 allroad 2.5TDi - family tank
    2003 S4 Avant 4.2 V8 - daily burble

    Purveyor of HomeFries and Exclusive agent for Samco hose kits (S2/RS2)

    There are only 10 kinds of people that understand binary - those that do, and those that don't
  • rj scotty
    S2Forum Fiend
    • May 2006
    • 2195
    • Home: United Kingdom Current: England

    #2
    Mighty impressive.

    This is gonna be my next turbo

    So keeping the stock bottom end is a no ?

    Still I like the sound of lag free performance.


    cheers

    rich
    sigpic
    "For what you spent on that you could have brought a new car"
    BUT I DON'T WANT A NEW CAR!

    1995 S2 Avant, Volcano Black
    1982 VW Golf Mk1, primer yellow, will be finished one day, maybe.
    2003 VW T4 long nose X pack, (has become project)

    Comment

    • urquattro-island
      S2Forum Extremist
      • Mar 2006
      • 1915
      • Home: Norway Current: Iceland

      #3
      thats

      a nice one paul. Good figures on stock bottom, seems like a fine turbo, like a driveable one.
      japanischer industriabfall nein danke!!
      www.rackeltrim.se Icelandic Division

      Comment

      • A80Avant
        S2Forum Obsessed
        • Sep 2005
        • 10873
        • Country: Greece

        #4
        this goes by saying of how wrong my g-tech calibration was to begin with...revs all over the place.So i cant compare.
        Now it is sold

        nice results by the way!

        Comment

        • S2central.net
          Retired OG Mod
          • Jul 2003
          • 16590
          • Country: Northern Ireland

          #5
          Originally posted by rj scotty
          Mighty impressive.

          This is gonna be my next turbo

          So keeping the stock bottom end is a no ?

          Still I like the sound of lag free performance.


          cheers

          rich
          Stock bottom end is absolutely fine at these boost levels, but if you went mad with a big fat WG spring and programmed up very high boost then you should think about a set of forged rods.

          I am surprised how well this goes on AAN cams... Something higher lift on EX side like 7A, NM or ADU would almost certainly increase the top end - but I suspect at the sacrifice of low-mid range.

          PS - These results on Asda 95RON fuel !
          Paul Nugent
          Webmaster http://S2central.net
          Administrator http://S2forum.com

          1994 S2 Coupe ABY - aka Project Lazarus
          2001 A6 allroad 2.5TDi - family tank
          2003 S4 Avant 4.2 V8 - daily burble

          Purveyor of HomeFries and Exclusive agent for Samco hose kits (S2/RS2)

          There are only 10 kinds of people that understand binary - those that do, and those that don't

          Comment

          • rj scotty
            S2Forum Fiend
            • May 2006
            • 2195
            • Home: United Kingdom Current: England

            #6
            If stock internals can be retained this is THE turbo to go for on the s2 in my opinion.

            Your results confirm this.

            cheers

            rich
            sigpic
            "For what you spent on that you could have brought a new car"
            BUT I DON'T WANT A NEW CAR!

            1995 S2 Avant, Volcano Black
            1982 VW Golf Mk1, primer yellow, will be finished one day, maybe.
            2003 VW T4 long nose X pack, (has become project)

            Comment

            • vcosmin
              S2Forum Maniac
              • Apr 2008
              • 644
              • Country: Romania

              #7
              Originally posted by S2central.net
              A picture speaks a thousand words - See attached GTech results

              Makes one big lump of UrS4 Avant go rather swiftly... courtesy of some real-time mapping today - bit frustrated by a dodgy MAF which wasted some time, but boy did a replacement make a difference.

              We didn't want to do lots of launches - this was the 1st one - not enough road for the full 1/4 mile but thats life. A subsequent one didn't hook up as well and yielded a bit slower.

              Needs a bit more fettling in real-time... To cut a long story short, my software needs some more bells and whistles to make things as easy as OLS in real-time mode. For the time being - there's quite a lot of trial error to zoom into the desired points. But I'm so glad not to have to do umpteen chip swaps anymore...

              Produces 1.5bar boost from 3000 (dunno boost threshold - but its good and low)
              Maxing about 1.7bar from 4500-5500
              Tailing off to 1.5bar at the redline

              This is NOT a laggy machine at all - very tractable and progressive.

              The real max torque figures will be higher than those shown - this launch data gave us power & torque in 3rd gear... Loading it up in 4th or higher from 2000rpm would yield higher numbers - we just didn't do them.

              So here's the highlights :

              0-60 in 4.2s and onto 100 in less than 10s
              367bhp - nett horsepower at the wheels (circa 5900)
              339ftlbs - 450Nm (~5000rpm)

              Pretty sure this turbo will go even higher boost - tried a little for that, but it feels like a bigger WG spring is going to be needed to counteract the WG creep. That or some funky twin port modulation on the WG.

              Not sure I'd want to go more boost on it without a stronger bottom end - this thing is stock except for the bigger turbo, EM and injectors... Stock bottom end, stock head & cams... Stock airbox... Only other extra is a mighty big intercooler which keeps air temps in control. Under some quite strenuous prolonged load tests I saw IAT of 60 degree celsius. No way the stock IC would cope with this. Oh and it has an uprated clutch - hybrid of Sachs and Spec from memory.

              I haven't done any other calculations based on GTech results but this must be into 430bhp territory (assuming 15% drivetrain losses).

              This kind of power in an S2 or UR would be even more amazing - Des is building a UR on a 20VT engine with a 3071R turbo - I am going to need extra pairs of kaks to ride shotgun in that thing. It'll be almost 700kg lighter for a start.

              Enough for now...
              Very fast, for an URS4. I checked ETKA today, and AAN and ADU rods are same code. Do you thing that this rods will need upgrade if you map the car for more torque?

              Comment

              • Jamo
                Retired OG Mod
                • Mar 2004
                • 21750
                • Country: United Kingdom

                #8
                Originally posted by S2central.net
                Stock bottom end is absolutely fine at these boost levels, but if you went mad with a big fat WG spring and programmed up very high boost then you should think about a set of forged rods.

                I am surprised how well this goes on AAN cams... Something higher lift on EX side like 7A, NM or ADU would almost certainly increase the top end - but I suspect at the sacrifice of low-mid range.

                PS - These results on Asda 95RON fuel !
                Garrett turbo's seem to perform better on stock cams across the range.

                When mine is running have to see what it's like with the NM inlet and exhaust.

                Comment

                • Rusty
                  Super Moderator
                  • Jun 2004
                  • 18953
                  • Country: United Kingdom

                  #9
                  Mighty impressive and on a stock bottom end! I've been watching the progress with interest. Always liked the idea of a 2871 and this makes it look even more tempting. I'll need to get back to work and get earning! Looking at £5k for what I want to finish her off...
                  Cheers'en, AndyC
                  1994 ABY Coupe - Projekt Alpinweiss

                  Comment

                  • S4turbo
                    S2Forum Fanatic
                    • Nov 2005
                    • 81
                    • Country: Norway

                    #10
                    Very nice results!

                    You should definately make a hp/torque graph by starting off slowly , changing to the desired gear at low rpm, and then full throttle through the whole rpm range, that will give a curve that is much easier to compare and will show the correct rpm/hp/torque behaviour of the engine.

                    One question, what trim did the 2871 used here have?

                    Best regards, Johan

                    Comment

                    • K7ERG
                      S2Forum Extremist
                      • Mar 2004
                      • 1711
                      • Country: Scotland

                      #11
                      good results! Looking forward to see what results i get with the gt3071r. I will be running more boost but i have the rods done.
                      Audi A6 AEL 5cyl Quattro breaking.
                      Audi A5 3.0tdi Quattro Stage 2
                      07947385043

                      Comment

                      • A80Avant
                        S2Forum Obsessed
                        • Sep 2005
                        • 10873
                        • Country: Greece

                        #12
                        i just noticed that you used 4320lbs which is 1960Kg!!!

                        now according to specs the car weighs around 1660Kg (factory announcement)... How heavy are you guys???

                        I have done runs on friends RS2 with 2 people on board and stuff on the trunk,but never managed to reach 1900Kg as measuring weights!!

                        Comment

                        • vcosmin
                          S2Forum Maniac
                          • Apr 2008
                          • 644
                          • Country: Romania

                          #13
                          How much was the rollout ? is seems that is very good time, on 1/8mile - this is 200m ? thist will translate in about 11.xx ? on 400m

                          Comment

                          • S2central.net
                            Retired OG Mod
                            • Jul 2003
                            • 16590
                            • Country: Northern Ireland

                            #14
                            That weight is correct - was done on a weighbridge before it came to me on a previous visit.

                            The rollout is GTech default at 12 inches - I've never changed that.
                            Paul Nugent
                            Webmaster http://S2central.net
                            Administrator http://S2forum.com

                            1994 S2 Coupe ABY - aka Project Lazarus
                            2001 A6 allroad 2.5TDi - family tank
                            2003 S4 Avant 4.2 V8 - daily burble

                            Purveyor of HomeFries and Exclusive agent for Samco hose kits (S2/RS2)

                            There are only 10 kinds of people that understand binary - those that do, and those that don't

                            Comment

                            • merlin's S4
                              S2Forum Extremist
                              • Jan 2005
                              • 1539
                              • Country: United Kingdom

                              #15
                              Please stop this madness now!!!! You're making me want a 2871R , anyone wanna buy my RS2 turbo!?!

                              Fantatic results there Paul, well done!
                              '93 S4 Avant now back on the road complete with new shiny go faster bits.

                              Comment

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