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Wiring Masters Needed B3 90q with AAN swap

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  • #46
    It worked in the donor car so I just assumed the ECU should be working. It also spits out codes. How should I get a hold of Steve?

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Durr McDanks View Post
      It worked in the donor car so I just assumed the ECU should be working. It also spits out codes. How should I get a hold of Steve?
      If it is spitting out codes, it is likely alive. Do you want to share some of these codes, besides the G28 engine speed sensor code (that all non-running engines will spit out)?
      RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
      94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

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      • #48
        Are you near any of the people listed in this quattroworld UrS4/S6 forum member location post:

        http://forums.quattroworld.com/s4s6/msgs/69040.phtml

        Hopefully you are and they can try your ECU in their car for a few minutes.
        RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
        94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

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        • #49
          I am only getting one code and its the G28 code.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Durr McDanks View Post
            I am only getting one code and its the G28 code.
            Presumably that is a false positive (i.e. G28 = engine rpm sensor). However, it might not be. (If the ECU does not get an RPM reading of 25 RPM or more during the time the starter is engaged, it is not happy and will not trigger the FP relay, etc.).
            RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
            94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

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            • #51
              Regardless of that sensor though I should get spark because the coils arent wired into the FPR right? I also went ahead and replaced the G28 sensor with a new one just to make sure. Also, I am getting fuel as well but I havent check if it actually sprays out the injectors... still working on getting spark.

              I went and double checked the timing and its spot on so its looking like something is off with the ECU. FWIW, Its tuned by MRC. I will take a look at that list and try to find someone in the area with a AAN motor thanks. Just in case, could I get a way off contacting Steve?
              Last edited by Durr McDanks; 31 January 2011, 03:03.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Durr McDanks View Post
                Regardless of that sensor though I should get spark because the coils arent wired into the FPR right? I also went ahead and replaced the G28 sensor with a new one just to make sure. Also, I am getting fuel as well but I havent check if it actually sprays out the injectors... still working on getting spark.

                I went and double checked the timing and its spot on so its looking like something is off with the ECU. FWIW, Its tuned by MRC. I will take a look at that list and try to find someone in the area with a AAN motor thanks. Just in case, could I get a way off contacting Steve?
                When you replaced the G28, did you pull the G4 and G28 together as a unit? If so, did you happen to check to see whether your flywheel has a crank pin, like the one shown here (no flywheel pin = no crank position sensor G4 signal = no spark):

                RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
                94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

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                • #53
                  I didnt actually verify that there was a pin but I did put a zip tip in there and it was getting flicked, but I will check visually for a pin. Would the fuel pump be working if the G28 pin wasnt there?
                  Last edited by Durr McDanks; 31 January 2011, 17:20.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Durr McDanks View Post
                    I didnt actually verify that there was a pin but I did put a zip tip in there and it was getting flicked, but I will check visually for a pin. Would the fuel pump be working if the G28 pin wasnt there?
                    The G28 sensor (RPM) counts teeth on the flywheel ring gear (135). It is the G4 that is looking for the pin. http://forums.quattroworld.com/s4s6/msgs/20986.phtml


                    RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
                    94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

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                    • #55
                      Sorry, would the fuel pump still pump if the G4 wasnt picking up the pin?

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Durr McDanks View Post
                        Sorry, would the fuel pump still pump if the G4 wasnt picking up the pin?
                        Have you positively established that you have fuel at the fuel rail while the starter is engaged? Probably easiest to pull the injectors and fuel rail out of intake manifold as a unit, placing a glass jar under each of the five injectors and having somebody turn the ignition to start and see if anything comes out. If it does, you know that the FP relay is being activated.

                        I can't remember if you are getting 12V (or 11.3V) to the coils with the ignition just on (and not turned to START).

                        If you are getting fuel and have 12V at the coils, then it means, for some reason, the ECU does not know when to send the 12V to ground through the internal POS in the 034 HO coils. This goes back to not having the proper crank timing pin for the G4.
                        RS2'd 93 UrS4 5 spd sedan
                        94 UrS4 V8 6 spd manual avant

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                        • #57
                          If fuel pump is activated and fuel is getting to the rail then ECU is getting RPM signal from G28.... The fault code comes up cos its not running.

                          If you aren't getting spark then either G4 (crank pin) signal is missing or weak. ALternatively - the G40 (dissy/hall/camshaft) signal is missing, weak or arriving out of expected phase alignment.

                          This is where you need a scope to test this properly - The G40 pulse must encapsulate every alternate G4 (crank) pulse... If the dissy or timing belt alignment is wrong then the pulses don't line up properly and the ECU hasn't got enough information to determine where and when #1 is at ==> it doesn't spark or pulse injectors.

                          All of this assumes you have nominal 12V into coils, the POS units are wired correctly and the grounds are all good. Its easier when I wire these things up myself - diagnosing them ~4000 miles away is a bit trickier, but hopefully we are getting somewhere.
                          Paul Nugent
                          Webmaster http://S2central.net
                          Administrator http://S2forum.com

                          1994 S2 Coupe ABY - aka Project Lazarus
                          2001 A6 allroad 2.5TDi - family tank
                          2003 S4 Avant 4.2 V8 - daily burble

                          Purveyor of HomeFries and Exclusive agent for Samco hose kits (S2/RS2)

                          There are only 10 kinds of people that understand binary - those that do, and those that don't

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                          • #58
                            Now, I am getting 12.5V at the power leads for the coils after I found a better battery charger. I still have no spark but I know that I am getting fuel because there is fuel in the lines but I am NOT sure if its coming out of the injectors. I will check this.

                            Originally posted by UrS4boy View Post
                            Have you positively established that you have fuel at the fuel rail while the starter is engaged? Probably easiest to pull the injectors and fuel rail out of intake manifold as a unit, placing a glass jar under each of the five injectors and having somebody turn the ignition to start and see if anything comes out. If it does, you know that the FP relay is being activated.

                            I can't remember if you are getting 12V (or 11.3V) to the coils with the ignition just on (and not turned to START).

                            If you are getting fuel and have 12V at the coils, then it means, for some reason, the ECU does not know when to send the 12V to ground through the internal POS in the 034 HO coils. This goes back to not having the proper crank timing pin for the G4.

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                            • #59
                              I know its aligned I have check three times and the crank and cam dots are aligned. Second, the coils are grounded to the back of the cam cover and the POS units are deleted due to the 034 high output coil kit. The kit also comes with very specific instructions on how to hook up the brown and black connectors. I will double check to see if the flywheel pin is still there and check to make sure the G28 and G4 sensors aren't in opposing electrical connectors. When I am looking for the pin, should the pin be in the peek hole when the cam and crank are aligned or is it random.

                              FWIW: I have a AAN flywheel not 7A combined with my stock transmission.

                              Originally posted by S2central.net View Post
                              If fuel pump is activated and fuel is getting to the rail then ECU is getting RPM signal from G28.... The fault code comes up cos its not running.

                              If you aren't getting spark then either G4 (crank pin) signal is missing or weak. ALternatively - the G40 (dissy/hall/camshaft) signal is missing, weak or arriving out of expected phase alignment.

                              This is where you need a scope to test this properly - The G40 pulse must encapsulate every alternate G4 (crank) pulse... If the dissy or timing belt alignment is wrong then the pulses don't line up properly and the ECU hasn't got enough information to determine where and when #1 is at ==> it doesn't spark or pulse injectors.

                              All of this assumes you have nominal 12V into coils, the POS units are wired correctly and the grounds are all good. Its easier when I wire these things up myself - diagnosing them ~4000 miles away is a bit trickier, but hopefully we are getting somewhere.

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                              • #60
                                P.S. thank you guys for all your help so far really appreciated

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