starting discussion on the use of new VW 2.5L 5Cyl in Small Chassis

[Mcstiff]

Or

[Zoig]

good read about the new TTRS engine, it's not the same as the 2.5MPI that is used for the base here, but good read nevertheless.

http://www.justfourrings.com/forums/documents/l5ttrs.pdf

[Jack4688]

Has anyone put this engine into a B6/B7 quattro yet?

[URQguy]

Couple of cars getting real close in b6 and b7s

Yes, the GDI and MPI engines are different, but the difference is equivalent to saying the 3b engine is superior to the 7a engine because of a different head, different pistons, etc. When they released the 20vt in the 3b form, they talked about how hi tech it was because of the sodium filled valves, the forged pistons, the water distribution to head equally, overboost, etc. Now we look at those differences as basically not being differences at all. A lot of hte information in that PDF is Audi tooting it's own horn in "developing" and engine that already existed.

Hank

[meep]

Sooooo got myself one of theese.
Now just need to fit it and start hunting for parts.

Out of curiosity ( yea i know it killed the cat )
Do anyone have any information regarding how far you can take the stock internals?
Also how far stock cams and head will go?
I dont fancy breaking this the first think i do.

[Chris M]

We have 2 of these engines at the shop. The heads are good for big power but the stock bottom ends are quite weak due to small wrist pins.

[URQguy]

So long time no post. The car has gone through a few revisions and we have perfected some of the parts so we can "kit" the swap and sleep at night. The oiling is spot on, the clutch and flywheel is spot on, and we are rolling not only 250+ dyno pulls on it now, but also a few track days not dropping below 6000 for half hour at a time.

The biggest North American European Magazine had interest in a front page feature, so we had to be quiet with pictures and details for a bit. It is released now( [http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1032] ) so more details can be had.





















In other news, we had it back on the dyno after the Magazine shoot/article. We had left a lot on the table as we didn't want a blown motor or to push a new setup prior to the shoot. With that out of the way, we went back and maxed the turbo out on e85. We have a suspicion the exhaust valves are being closed above 6500 due to soft oem springs. We don't see the drop off nearly as bad at 25psi as we do at 35-36psi. Regardless, the car is making great power. The graph below shows what chipped 7a 20v does with a big MAF, upgraded injectors, exhaust and intake(scaled so poorly, it doesn't even look like a curve). Yes, 1 07k cylinder is besting all 5 and 2.3L worth of NA fury. With a larger gears in the 01e, and bigger rubber, we usually see around 23% drivetrain loss. If you do the math there, this engine is roughly at 833bhp. We have put springs in it now, some cams in the work and some other msall revisions. We won't make any more peak power, but we will likely extend the powerband a little. The goal for hte project was 600whp/600wtq, so we are right there. I am trying to talk the customer into a slightly larger HTA3586r, but for now he is happy as a clam. Pretty impressive for a stock head and just rods and pistons. Zero port work and zero valvetrain work. It might look a tad laggy on the charts, but htat is because we ran it in Las Vegas summer weather of 107 degree, and the extra load down low was making high end IAT's too high for comfort. On the street, we are spooling around 3800 in 3rd. I can load the Vems Log for anybody curious.





Shoot me an email at HankIroz@IrozMotorsport.com for more details. I don't hop on here very often. Forgive me if I am a little tardy in response. We are still a pretty small shop still and lots of emails, especially in the last month since the mag release.

Cheers.

Hank

[Greg_S]

I've fixed the you tube video for you, just need the video ID bit not the whole URL.

Excellent project and dyno curve looks pretty smooth given the setup, excellent work

[Thuppu]

Wow, just amazing!

[URQguy]

Thanks for the link fix!

[Billman]

Yes post the vemslog please!

[URQguy]

http://www.europeancarweb.com/featuredcars/1407_1983_audi_quattro_with_tt_rs_engine/

Here is a more friendly link to the article in European Car Magazine. It also has a small video about the car

Hank

[gnutz2]

Has this been mentioned before!



I've never even heard of an old 5 cylinder crank snapping, let alone seen a picture. And lots of us use a single mass flywheel.

[elaw]

Yikes!

Then again, just because the guy *claims* it's the fault of the flywheel doesn't mean it is. There are a bunch of other things that could cause that.

I'd be a lot more convinced if there was a pattern among a large number of engines with similar configurations, and the ones with SM flywheels were failing and the ones with DM flywheels weren't.

[Ruffiano]

Yikes!

Then again, just because the guy *claims* it's the fault of the flywheel doesn't mean it is. There are a bunch of other things that could cause that.

I'd be a lot more convinced if there was a pattern among a large number of engines with similar configurations, and the ones with SM flywheels were failing and the ones with DM flywheels weren't.

truth is, hank has seen two of his die due to the SM, and many other documented cases.

Its all about harmonics.