~delta, I Salute You

[jubjub]

Charlie, sorry to say I can offer no assistance that will help I have been reading this thread though and can understand how pissed off you get Drives you round the bend when you don't seem to get anywhere.......
Really do hope you get it sorted ASAP

Maybe if someone on the Forum with knowledge of these is passing around your way, they may be able to offer an opinion........

Like I say good luck in getting a quick fix sorted

[newsh]

Damn was really hoping it would be the ign. switch.

Anyway, it'll start on a push but not on the key, could it be a voltage issue, ie the battery cannot cope with turning the engine over AND running the ignition and fuel management, could be a bad ground somewhere or a high resistance joint meaning when the engine cranks the voltage at the ecu or some other component drops too low?

[Mark Halligan]

could be a bad ground somewhere or a high resistance joint meaning when the engine cranks the voltage at the ecu or some other component drops too low?

Yep makes sense........like Sal said over on the other thread, are the TWO earth leads that connect to the bottom of the IM secure?

[quattronutter]

a faulty starter motor can also cause this,shorting inside and draining the battery at the same time ...also check the wiring to and from the starter alternator etc..

[~Delta]

...Or isues with the crank sensor. These include:

1) Faulty sensor.
2) Crank sensor wiring faulty.
3) Incorrect distance between crank sensor and flywheel pin.
4) Broken / bent flywheel pin.

The car will push start on all the above conditions, the crank sensor becomes redundant once the car is running, as the sensor only gives crank angle info to the ECU for injector / firing phase. Once the car is running through pushing, the ECU then "learns" and stores the info.

The same applies to the 3B, RR and 7A. The car can be started by the key, then you can actually unplug the Hall sender from the distributor, as well as disconnect the crank sensor, without interrupting the engine running.

I rekon the most like culprit in Charlie's car is mechanical - incorrect clearance between the crank sensor and firing pin on the flywheel. I know there is no adjustment, but there is still a minimum and maximum distance gap between sensor and pin (these values are in Audi's workshop manuals). To increase the gap, a thin washer / s is / are needed between the sensor and the mounting block (with the allen bolt going through). To reduce the gap, the sensor has to be carefully filed down at the mounting point, and compensated with washers as required.

If reducing the gap, the engine has to be rotated by hand to make sure the pin does not strike the sensor. Daft thing is, the clearance figures Audi give can only be correctly determined with the transmission removed from the car.

[charlie]

Some Good News

Tow started it in reverse and have just covered my first 100 miles.
Boy does that engine feel tight, Very very tight.

Went to Bexley Audi & their Cheif technician asked me
to check for wire 15A that runs from Starter motor to ECU.
If this wire is snapped or shorting out, The ECU will not know that
the car is trying to start and will not Fire coil pack....
Anyone heard of this or come across this before.
Ps: car stalled at Audi but the boys were kind enough to push start

An independent VW/Audi specialist said from his experience, if the
rebuilt engine is tight , the starter might not have enough kick
to turnover the engine quick enough and might be drawing too much
current from the battery hence not enough juice left for ecu and coil packs

Adviced to do about 200 miles and see how it gets along.

[jubjub]

Aha, that explains it then. Eyes popped out of my head when I saw a Silver RS2 today coming of the A2 at Danson Park/ Bexley. Obviously you then Charlie...Glad you seem to be getting somewhere.

No nead to post a spotted thread now

[twoqu]

Hi!
Have you physically verified that the pin is intact?
If not remove the starter and get someone to turn the engine over. Pretty sure if the pin has gone you get no spark. The engine will turn over but not catch.

[charlie]

Hi!
Have you physically verified that the pin is intact?
If not remove the starter and get someone to turn the engine over. Pretty sure if the pin has gone you get no spark. The engine will turn over but not catch.

Pin verified. but will double check. Took out g4 sensor and turned flywheel
until 60-ish deg. BTDC and noticed the unusual shape of pin.

[charlie]

Aha, that explains it then. Eyes popped out of my head when I saw a Silver RS2 today coming of the A2 at Danson Park/ Bexley. Obviously you then Charlie...Glad you seem to be getting somewhere.

No nead to post a spotted thread now

Hi dean, did you notice the huge writting on the back window
" RUNNING IN, PLEASE OVERTAKE" As i was doing 40MPH MAX.

[jubjub]

Did not have the faintest idea it was you.I saw you come of the roundabout and beared right. As I watced, I did see the white paper in the back from a distance, and thought it may have been a for sale sign That explains it now.......

[twoqu]

Pin verified. but will double check. Took out g4 sensor and turned flywheel
until 60-ish deg. BTDC and noticed the unusual shape of pin.

As I recall it's quite difficult to see the pin through the timing sensor aperature, even when both are removed. Thats why I was suggesting removing the starter for a better squizz!
Its the one thats the engine side of the flywheel not those pins on the clutch side. They are for the VAG diagnostic sensors. You aren't getting those confused are you?
What was interesting about the unusual shape?

[volcano rs]

i cant believe that a tight engine should cause that much of a problem .engine should be able turn freely with starter motor regardless of it being tight unless it was seized which it obviously isn't . dosen't make sense .

[charlie]

As I recall it's quite difficult to see the pin through the timing sensor aperature, even when both are removed. Thats why I was suggesting removing the starter for a better squizz!
Its the one thats the engine side of the flywheel not those pins on the clutch side. They are for the VAG diagnostic sensors. You aren't getting those confused are you?
What was interesting about the unusual shape?

Actually if you remove both sensors G28 & G4, their is a metal bridge
that G4 sits on. remove the two bolts holding it on and you have an
open window of about 2"x 2".
The reason i done it this way, was to make sure that all the alignments
were true and calculate the true TDC and also to mark 62 degree on
both camshaft pulley and crankshaft pulley.

But will check again when i remove starter for inspection.

[charlie]

i cant believe that a tight engine should cause that much of a problem .engine should be able turn freely with starter motor regardless of it being tight unless it was seized which it obviously isn't . dosen't make sense .

I think it goes back to the X-relief circuit that is incoperated in all VAG cars.
trying to get any info from Audi is like >>>>>>>>>>>>