turbochargers for 500hp

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  • Albert
    S2Forum Extremist
    • Aug 2003
    • 1500
    • Country: Poland

    #136
    Originally posted by diesel des
    What sort of problems other than clutch slip. I want over 500 ft lb....

    Sent from my GT-N7105 using Tapatalk
    gearbox, clutch, drive shafts ect.

    My opinion is that the car should have flat torque line. Some cars are tuned that they have diesel line with neck braking power first and "nothing" at the end of the revs.
    AKmotorsport.net - Manufacturing Motorsport parts that do the job. | Audi S2 on Facebook | Best way of reaching me is sending email to albert@akmotorsport.net

    Comment

    • S2central.net
      Retired OG Mod
      • Jul 2003
      • 16590
      • Country: Northern Ireland

      #137
      Agreed... something like 600-650Nm from 2500-7500 would be amazing, but probably bends some laws of physics to achieve that !
      Paul Nugent
      Webmaster http://S2central.net
      Administrator http://S2forum.com

      1994 S2 Coupe ABY - aka Project Lazarus
      2001 A6 allroad 2.5TDi - family tank
      2003 S4 Avant 4.2 V8 - daily burble

      Purveyor of HomeFries and Exclusive agent for Samco hose kits (S2/RS2)

      There are only 10 kinds of people that understand binary - those that do, and those that don't

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      • Albert
        S2Forum Extremist
        • Aug 2003
        • 1500
        • Country: Poland

        #138
        If you have 600Nm from 4000 to 7500 rpm it is good enouth. You have to use gerbox some times

        500Nm at 7500 gives over 500HP
        AKmotorsport.net - Manufacturing Motorsport parts that do the job. | Audi S2 on Facebook | Best way of reaching me is sending email to albert@akmotorsport.net

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        • Jaswan
          S2Forum Maniac
          • Apr 2011
          • 760
          • Home: United Kingdom Current: England

          #139
          Originally posted by Albert
          gearbox, clutch, drive shafts ect.

          X2

          plus rods and crank shaft.

          Comment

          • Thuppu
            S2Forum Freak
            • Sep 2010
            • 4115
            • Country: Finland

            #140
            So not much to worry about then. I assume all who wants 500hp, have done the clutch and rods. 01E takes 700Nm no problem, don't know if anyone have found the limit for the crank, 1xxxNm..? Propably the driveshafts isn't the problem either if you don't launch from zero.

            Audi UrS4 Avant 2.5 20vt - twincharged - Project
            Audi 80q B4 Sedan 2.2 20vt - Daily user
            BMW 320d Touring e91 M-Sport - Daily user
            BMW 740iA e38 - Project

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            • Quattronaut
              S2Forum Addict
              • May 2013
              • 273
              • Country: Germany

              #141
              For short: at 7000rpm NMs=HP.

              Good response is necessary for track use, yes- but setting the peak power too low in rpm band is not optimal IMHO, because you are normally revving the gears out due to the lower gear ratio. So power from 2500-6000 won´t make you to happy. After revving to 7200 and then change gear, you are around 5500 rounds, depending on which gear it was. In this range, torque ist going down. So you loose 2500 rpm of real torque.

              I would set the peak power to around 7000rpm. With a good charger at 2,2L, boost then kicks in at around 4000 rpm, what fits better the profile of driving on race track, than an motor, that has torque from 2500 to 6000 rpm.

              I´m just building up a 2,5L stroker with K26/27;
              estimated:
              1,5 bar/ 550NM @ 3000rpm
              2,5 bar/ 750NM @ 3500 to 4500rpm
              2,0 bar/ 540hp @ 6500rpm

              I do not want to discuss this setup in here; but this IMO woul not be optimal for track, because peak power and max torque are too early in rpm band. With the same charger and 2,2L, both points should be 500-600 rpm higher, what fits track use much better.

              Comment

              • Albert
                S2Forum Extremist
                • Aug 2003
                • 1500
                • Country: Poland

                #142
                absolutry right !

                Gearbox:- Audi RS2 Gearbox
                Tyre:- 255/40/18
                Change rpm: 7500

                Top Speed in 1 gear = 64.981 KPH
                And changes into 2 gear at 4050 RPM dropping 3450 RPM
                Top Speed in 2 gear = 120.335 KPH
                And changes into 3 gear at 5238 RPM dropping 2262 RPM
                Top Speed in 3 gear = 172.298 KPH
                And changes into 4 gear at 5852 RPM dropping 1648 RPM
                Top Speed in 4 gear = 220.809 KPH
                And changes into 5 gear at 6262 RPM dropping 1238 RPM
                Top Speed in 5 gear = 264.457 KPH
                And changes into 6 gear at 6192 RPM dropping 1308 RPM
                Top Speed in 6 gear = 320.328 KPH
                The power must be 5000-7500 or 4500-7000 depends how high you rev the engine

                It is important how much power you have on wheels. Short - engine Nm x gearbox = power at wheels. It is much better to stay on lower gear and rev maximally high. It is not goot to have 650Nm at 4500 and 500Nm at 7000 rpm. It is "fun to drive" but the car is not fast. Better to have 550Nm all the power band (5000-7500).
                Last edited by Albert; 15 October 2014, 14:56.
                AKmotorsport.net - Manufacturing Motorsport parts that do the job. | Audi S2 on Facebook | Best way of reaching me is sending email to albert@akmotorsport.net

                Comment

                • S2central.net
                  Retired OG Mod
                  • Jul 2003
                  • 16590
                  • Country: Northern Ireland

                  #143
                  We are talking about torque not power !!!
                  I want that 600Nm all the way across the Rev range. Torque translates to the cars ability to accelerate which is where the fun comes in and of course improved agility in competitive use. Power translates to maximum speed which is all fine wide open on the autobahn but not something you can use every day !
                  Paul Nugent
                  Webmaster http://S2central.net
                  Administrator http://S2forum.com

                  1994 S2 Coupe ABY - aka Project Lazarus
                  2001 A6 allroad 2.5TDi - family tank
                  2003 S4 Avant 4.2 V8 - daily burble

                  Purveyor of HomeFries and Exclusive agent for Samco hose kits (S2/RS2)

                  There are only 10 kinds of people that understand binary - those that do, and those that don't

                  Comment

                  • Thuppu
                    S2Forum Freak
                    • Sep 2010
                    • 4115
                    • Country: Finland

                    #144
                    I had a 235hp/700Nm diesel Bimmer that got the max torque at 2000 rpm's. If I compare it to my UrS I must say the UrS is a lot more fun.

                    Audi UrS4 Avant 2.5 20vt - twincharged - Project
                    Audi 80q B4 Sedan 2.2 20vt - Daily user
                    BMW 320d Touring e91 M-Sport - Daily user
                    BMW 740iA e38 - Project

                    Comment

                    • A80Avant
                      S2Forum Obsessed
                      • Sep 2005
                      • 10873
                      • Country: Greece

                      #145
                      Originally posted by S2central.net
                      We are talking about torque not power !!!
                      I want that 600Nm all the way across the Rev range. Torque translates to the cars ability to accelerate which is where the fun comes in and of course improved agility in competitive use. Power translates to maximum speed which is all fine wide open on the autobahn but not something you can use every day !
                      Which practically makes a this 500hp turbo setup talk pointless as the most important factor which is what is the car used for is missed out.

                      As you I want an everyday responsive car. Therefore I'm not interested to change gears at 70 rpm and the rest of it. I'm interested to be agile. Why would I want 500hp? Well because at 1.7 tons it's not the lightest car to move around and also I don't want it to be a diesel and drop off any power after 4000rpm

                      Comment

                      • nicksonmsport
                        S2Forum Addict
                        • Mar 2014
                        • 380
                        • Country: United Kingdom

                        #146
                        this car will be light approx 1 tonne, and it will be rwd so more power at wheels compared to 4wd.

                        as said the torque band needs to be between 4000-7500 rpm to make most of in gear acceleration on track. I just want the turbo to spool up nice and quickly between gear changes so the power is on tap straight away.

                        Comment

                        • Quattronaut
                          S2Forum Addict
                          • May 2013
                          • 273
                          • Country: Germany

                          #147
                          So here we are with turbos for 500hp:

                          Garrett GTX3071/ GTX3076
                          BorgWarner EFR7064/ EFR7670
                          KKK K26/3371O 8.12 (12,5)/ K27.2/3371O 9.12

                          The first ones for just around 500hp, better spool, the second ones for more power, more lag.

                          Some Turbonetics, Precision and Holsets as well, but since I do not know them, someone else should name them :-)

                          I would prefer the second chargers, as they will give not only more power, but the power at the right place in the rpm-band.
                          Last edited by Quattronaut; 15 October 2014, 17:43.

                          Comment

                          • quattro-nick
                            S2Forum Extremist
                            • Sep 2012
                            • 1746
                            • Country: Belgium

                            #148
                            today dyno result gt3076r A/R 0.82

                            audi coupe quattro b2 2.2 20vt project (573hp-626nm)
                            TWINCHARGED power,zero lag
                            AEM W/M injection

                            Comment

                            • snp10
                              S2Forum Enthusiast
                              • Nov 2012
                              • 189
                              • Country: Romania

                              #149
                              Good result. Maybe with w/m system you can gain more power.

                              Comment

                              • pasbogdan
                                S2Forum Extremist
                                • Sep 2009
                                • 1160
                                • Country: Romania

                                #150
                                Originally posted by Quattronaut
                                For short: at 7000rpm NMs=HP.

                                Good response is necessary for track use, yes- but setting the peak power too low in rpm band is not optimal IMHO, because you are normally revving the gears out due to the lower gear ratio. So power from 2500-6000 won´t make you to happy. After revving to 7200 and then change gear, you are around 5500 rounds, depending on which gear it was. In this range, torque ist going down. So you loose 2500 rpm of real torque.

                                I would set the peak power to around 7000rpm. With a good charger at 2,2L, boost then kicks in at around 4000 rpm, what fits better the profile of driving on race track, than an motor, that has torque from 2500 to 6000 rpm.

                                I´m just building up a 2,5L stroker with K26/27;
                                estimated:
                                1,5 bar/ 550NM @ 3000rpm
                                2,5 bar/ 750NM @ 3500 to 4500rpm
                                2,0 bar/ 540hp @ 6500rpm

                                I do not want to discuss this setup in here; but this IMO woul not be optimal for track, because peak power and max torque are too early in rpm band. With the same charger and 2,2L, both points should be 500-600 rpm higher, what fits track use much better.
                                This thinking is for track.But what do you do if you like your car for rally/hill climb?
                                400 hp aby s2 with hx35 and k26 hotside is worse to drive and i can bet time on a tight corners ss or track is worse compared to k24 7000 turbine with 1.5 bar peak and 1 bar at redline mod.
                                The question is what you want to do with your car?

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