Hi @ all,
since the first thread had to be closed due to bad accents I raise that topic again. No battle for best dyno, no ecological interest for manufacturers or tuners. Keep this as an info-thread with turbochargers, that are stand-alone capable of 500 hp crank power. No E85, no WMI, nothing else.
For that power and torque lowering the CR via another headgasket or machining head or pistons is necessary; that lowers motor efficiency, but more boost is poaasible. Stock cams could be difficult to use, upgrade ones (7A, RS2 or aftermarket) will simplify it.
So as kind of an introduction:
For a certain power output, your need a certain amount of fuel burned. Burning a certain amount of fuel needs a certain amount of air. Turbochargers can flow a certain amount of air, limitted through the rpm limit given by size and material strength. That´s the secret
For reaching secure 500hp with our 20VT, you need around 1550kg air/ hr, what is ~57lbs per minute (factor is 27.126). Since all turbos use similar materials, technology and physical laws, you can conclude, that similar sizes mean similar power limits. That is compressor wheel from 70-78mm to 50-58mm; turbine wheel 65-70mm to 55-62mm.
Little over 500hp is a kind of reasonable limit in our motors using hydraulic valvetrain; bigger turbos boost later, so usable powerband gets to small for making sense in daily driven cars. Stepping over that line makes only sense with strongly modified heads with mechanical valvetrain, IMHO.
Following turbos I know the air flowing capacitiy and therefore am quite sure they will work:
Garrett:
GTX3071 (maxed out); GTX3076R; GT3582R and higher
BW:
EFR 7064 (maxed out); EFR7670 and higher
KKK:
K26 3371 O...8.12 (b:12,5mm)(=>K26/27 with "8" th); K27.2 3371 O...9.11 or 11.11 and higher
The GTX3071 and the EFR7064 maybe at limit; here the biggest turbine housing should be used. Smaller turbine housings give better spool, but choke earlier. For 500 hp a „8“ hotside is absolutely the minimum IMHO. Newer motors such as the TFSIs, are more efficient, so a "500hp-on-our-old-motor"-turbo can produce a bit more power on a newer motor. Same effect is reached by well-made headworks, good cams, exhaust, good intercooler etc. All that can help those turbos that are running at limit to really reach it.
My statements are estimated very conservative; I hate showing off with high numbers, and I wanna use material in secure and reliable manner. In addition, german DIN power is measured a little different from e.g. british, what may result in smaller numbers. So yes, maybe, that someone reaches higher numbers than I estimate, by really maxing things out
Since I do not have measurings or technical data of other turbos, now it´s on your turn list will be copied/ pasted to later posts from time to time.
Feel free to comment, add to the list or ask. Hope, that everyone keeps right accents in here If my writing sounds a bit strange for some of you, I´m sorry- my english is not perfect corrections are
since the first thread had to be closed due to bad accents I raise that topic again. No battle for best dyno, no ecological interest for manufacturers or tuners. Keep this as an info-thread with turbochargers, that are stand-alone capable of 500 hp crank power. No E85, no WMI, nothing else.
For that power and torque lowering the CR via another headgasket or machining head or pistons is necessary; that lowers motor efficiency, but more boost is poaasible. Stock cams could be difficult to use, upgrade ones (7A, RS2 or aftermarket) will simplify it.
So as kind of an introduction:
For a certain power output, your need a certain amount of fuel burned. Burning a certain amount of fuel needs a certain amount of air. Turbochargers can flow a certain amount of air, limitted through the rpm limit given by size and material strength. That´s the secret
For reaching secure 500hp with our 20VT, you need around 1550kg air/ hr, what is ~57lbs per minute (factor is 27.126). Since all turbos use similar materials, technology and physical laws, you can conclude, that similar sizes mean similar power limits. That is compressor wheel from 70-78mm to 50-58mm; turbine wheel 65-70mm to 55-62mm.
Little over 500hp is a kind of reasonable limit in our motors using hydraulic valvetrain; bigger turbos boost later, so usable powerband gets to small for making sense in daily driven cars. Stepping over that line makes only sense with strongly modified heads with mechanical valvetrain, IMHO.
Following turbos I know the air flowing capacitiy and therefore am quite sure they will work:
Garrett:
GTX3071 (maxed out); GTX3076R; GT3582R and higher
BW:
EFR 7064 (maxed out); EFR7670 and higher
KKK:
K26 3371 O...8.12 (b:12,5mm)(=>K26/27 with "8" th); K27.2 3371 O...9.11 or 11.11 and higher
The GTX3071 and the EFR7064 maybe at limit; here the biggest turbine housing should be used. Smaller turbine housings give better spool, but choke earlier. For 500 hp a „8“ hotside is absolutely the minimum IMHO. Newer motors such as the TFSIs, are more efficient, so a "500hp-on-our-old-motor"-turbo can produce a bit more power on a newer motor. Same effect is reached by well-made headworks, good cams, exhaust, good intercooler etc. All that can help those turbos that are running at limit to really reach it.
My statements are estimated very conservative; I hate showing off with high numbers, and I wanna use material in secure and reliable manner. In addition, german DIN power is measured a little different from e.g. british, what may result in smaller numbers. So yes, maybe, that someone reaches higher numbers than I estimate, by really maxing things out
Since I do not have measurings or technical data of other turbos, now it´s on your turn list will be copied/ pasted to later posts from time to time.
Feel free to comment, add to the list or ask. Hope, that everyone keeps right accents in here If my writing sounds a bit strange for some of you, I´m sorry- my english is not perfect corrections are
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