Extended ball joints for lowered suspension?

[stiglet]

I will certainly keep this updated. There could be problems with this though, apparently they can foul the discs and it looks as though i'll have to ditch my 15" Speedlines

Will have to see....

[Fat Audi 80]

Can you get / make castor plates for the top mounts and move them inboard a little to add some negative camber?

How low are you, I can't believe you need to move the ball joint or the top of the strut THAT much?

Cheers,

Steve.

[stiglet]

Can you get / make castor plates for the top mounts and move them inboard a little to add some negative camber?

How low are you, I can't believe you need to move the ball joint or the top of the strut THAT much?

Cheers,

Steve.

You are are right, that would be far easier, but it's not the static camber thats the problem. It's the positive camber gain on hard cornering. Even at standard heights, Audi, similiar to VW with the Golfs, i now suspect will have designed in some front positive camber gain on purpose to make the car easier to drive on the limit and very progressive. I know they did this with the golf (a car with a very light rear end and what is effectively a very large RARB and it STILL understeers and it does so progressively) and after looking at pictures of my car on track i can see the angle of my wheels

I don't think more static neg camber will help, as that will just give me crap braking and bad tyre wear, as well as very odd cornering abilities in the wet and dry.

The problem here is to do with roll centres, body roll, and the wonderful marvel that is McPherson suspension geometry

[anton]

to keep the same geometry as standard you would need to lower the balljoint the same amount as you have lowered, for me 1.5" is less than half but anything that brings the wishbone back towards being flat is good in my books as they are currently pointing to the sky lol the only thing that concerns me with these is how long you can go before you a) start to foul things like wheel/brakes. and b) introduce too much shear stress into the part. another think to consider is the change in bump steer, not sure if this would be a good or a bad change?!?!?! either way when th time comes tfor me to rebuild they are already on my list
i also think more caster would give a decent ammount of benefit to our cars...

Ant

[Josh-stateside]

Maybe dumb idea, but instead of extending the ball joint, why not just add a spacer between the 3 bolts that connect the ball joint to the control arm?

[stiglet]

Maybe dumb idea, but instead of extending the ball joint, why not just add a spacer between the 3 bolts that connect the ball joint to the control arm?

The pivot point has to be lowered in relation to the hub/strut. Altering the position of the ball joint in relation to the control arm will do nothing unfortunately.

There is the other option of raising the subframe which has been done on motorgeeks, not sure how easy it is though....

[Josh-stateside]

The pivot point has to be lowered in relation to the hub/strut. Altering the position of the ball joint in relation to the control arm will do nothing unfortunately.

There is the other option of raising the subframe which has been done on motorgeeks, not sure how easy it is though....

I thought the point was to make the control arms back to parallel? Wouldn't that flatten out the control arms?

It seems like to me the best way to do all this would be to cut the strut tubes, flip the tie rod arm , shorten the strut tube, weld it all back together and get shorter shocks and then reconnect the tie rod underneath vs above the arm.

[stiglet]

Flipping the tie rod will solve the bump steer problem that i might have with these ball joints. And yes, you're right, the whole point of this is to lower the control arm BUT it isn't strictly the arm that needs lowering, it's the imaginary line formed from the centre of the ball joint to the inner pick-ups on the arm. This is what determines the roll centre and camber compensation. Hence, lowering the arm but not he ball joint makes no difference. The reaction line remains the same. Actual ball joint itself needs to be lowered with the lower control arm and everything else must stay in the same position (bar maybe the tie rod).

It's quite hard to explain in words, but this shows how the roll centre is determined.

[stiglet]

This is looking less and less likely

First of, there is definately a clearance issue;


It has been done before, but it involves putting a spacer in the hub and caliper carrier to bring the wheel (and disc) further out.

Secondly, the company in the States hasn't got back to me, so i may not get a set in the first place.

[Skull]

what car is this? afaik the B4 thing is straight, not so angled....

well a little angled...

[anton]

i was thinking i dont remember them being that close on mine. i'm sure if they cant post it to the UK as a company then someone in the states will send it to you, i may be cheeky and ask 034 as i will be buying stuff from them about the time i'll be wanting to buy these anyway....

Ant

[stiglet]

Finally got hold of the guy. He is making a batch now but it will take 3 weeks. They have to be heat treated, which I'm happy about to be honest!

I'm in a state of denial about the clearence issue. I'm hoping it's just a 1-peice strut thing....

[magarv]

Have you calculated the new roll center and get them to machine a custom length extender or are you going for the "stock" 1,5" length?

Keep us posted on delivery time, price etc

I am planing to do rebuild my suspension geometry this winter myself. Tubular wishbones, extenders etc.

[anton]

Have you calculated the new roll center and get them to machine a custom length extender or are you going for the "stock" 1,5" length?

Keep us posted on delivery time, price etc

I am planing to do rebuild my suspension geometry this winter myself. Tubular wishbones, extenders etc.

The max he will do is 2" as that is the limit before the stresses are too high in his opinion ant that stillwont get back to stock for any of us i dont think, i havn't even tried to do any droppercalcs but from rough diagrams i have done my roll center is well under ground level and this may 'just' bing it to ground lol

Ant

[redz]

The max he will do is 2" as that is the limit before the stresses are too high in his opinion ant that stillwont get back to stock for any of us i dont think, i havn't even tried to do any droppercalcs but from rough diagrams i have done my roll center is well under ground level and this may 'just' bing it to ground lol

Ant

I had these on my Mk1 Golf 2lt valver it worked really well, so I'd be well up for a pair or 2..

Andy