Lets have a mass debate on OIL

[s2avant95M]

OK, I am slightly confused about advice previously given on this forum regarding oil. Specifically it has been recommended that 10/60w oil from Millers or Castrol. There is a thread on Audifans Here that has posts from various people that contradicts this advice and information.

This information states that using this oil over a prolonged period will cause excessive wear and damage to these engines.

Tbh i dont mind who is correct, but i would like to know what the correct oil is for the I5 turbo charged engine, as found in S2's, RS2's etc.

Cheers

[dan_b]

Here's the specs on Millers CFS 10-60

Description
• Competition Full Synthetic Engine Oil
• Formulated with 100% synthetic base fluids, including a synergistic blend of three esters, combined with latest additive technology for maximum performance.

Application
Use as received for competition engines used in highly stressed conditions.

User Benefits
Fully synthetic oils provide many outstanding performance benefits over conventional mineral oil. By utilising both polyalphaolefins (PAO) and ester synthetics specially selected to minimise the amount of polymer used, the lubricant film provided is more resistant to ‘shear’ and viscosity loss in highly stress areas.

• Full synthetic oil provides:
- load carrying capacity up to six times that of mineral oil
- high film strength for ultimate protection
- outstanding cold flow properties for reduced wear at start up
excellent thermal stability and oxidation resistance

• The synergistic blend of three esters gives improved lubricity, reducing friction and enhancing the oils performance

• CFS 10W-60 formulated to protect larger competition engines operating under extreme conditions e.g. long distance racing, rallying in both normally aspirated and turbocharged engines

Performance Profile
• Suitable for all normally aspirated and turbocharged engines from 2 litres upwards.
• Ideal for large capacity V8 engines in all forms of motorsport.
• Suitable for operating at 125°C with peak temperatures up to 150°C
• For fast road use or track days in engines where a 10w/40 is normally specified


PI SJ
MB 229.1; MB 228.1
ACEA A2-96; B3-98; E2-96

Viscosity / Typical Characteristics
SAE Viscosity grade 10W-60
Density @ 15°C 0.867

[dan_b]

What I would like to see in this discussion is evidence and fact, not baseless opinion! We all pour this stuff in our engines, but that's about as much as we can really tell about what's going on in there once its running around?

[Ski]

well the bottle looks pretty. as to how it acts, i woudnt have a clue.

but i need to buy some so hurry up with ur discussions

[s2avant95M]

I am at work so i dont have the Owners manual to hand, so does anyone know what that recommends?

[PeteRR]

I'm using the Silkolene Pro S 10W-50 in mine. Great oil, the car runs sweet as on it.
I get mine from Opie oils.

[rotoryboy]

I'm using the Silkolene Pro S 10W-50 in mine. Great oil, the car runs sweet as on it.

This is what Mike and Oilman recommended so is in mine now, it's purple aswell

[Ross]

Where's the best place to get millers? I'm planning on getting some for the meet... what's the best interval for an oil change? I've heard conflicting views; some say keep it changed every 3-5k miles, others have said it takes 10s of thousands of miles before the carbon chains start to break down...

mines' looking quite black after about 4k miles so I'd think that it's more a case of the oil getting 'dirty' than breakng down that's the problem?

cheers
Ross

[S2Roo]

I used to own a high milage passat (1781cc petrol) and I always used Quantum Synta silver(semi-synth), I changed to Quantum Synta gold(fully synth), and the car started to burn some oil, so I returned to Quantum Synta silver(semi-synth). My friend has a 3000GTO, and he was using a high quality semi synth, he changed to a fully synth and his oil pressure was considerably lower, so he returned to semi synth.

I came to the conclusion that the fully synths are not viscous enought for higher milage engines, from my own experiences. Hence I use synta silver in my S2, and using the cost saving over synta gold to change the oil every 3000 miles.

I know that according to "does what it says on the tin" theory fully synths are supposed to be superior to semi synths, but I think they are more suited to race engines with very tight tolerences.

Alot of S2 engine must be getting on for starship millage now, and I know they are hard wearing but they must losen up a bit.

Does anyone factor in the age of their car when they are purchasing oil???

S2Roo

[dan_b]

I think the standard oil spec for UK running in normal temperatures and under normal loads is semi-synthetic 10/40? I imagine there may be different specifications for countries that experience greater extremes of temperature - ie. v. cold, or v. hot countries?

One thing I do know - when I used to run Synta Gold 10/40 in my car, hot idle pressure would drop to about 1.5bar. When I then tracked it that fell to almost 1bar and oil temps were exceeding 140C, with a subsequent drop in fast running oil pressure to around 3bar. With the 10/60, hot idle pressure is now 1.8-2.0bar and oil pressure is maintained over 4bar in fast running and high engine load.

This surely has to be better for the engine than the former?

[Billman]

i am going to use the M1 5w-50 in the next days! Tere was a big debate in a german forum about oils and there was someone that really had a clue on the oils and said that the Castrol RS 10w-60 is very bad in terms of cold start ect! Said that its additive pack is also not the last one! Said also that th eCastrol TWS 10-60 is a little better but also not the best choice! Said this oil is only good for Race cars that get really abused and did have to start several times a day with a cold engine!

According to him the State of The Art oil right now is the Mobil 1 5w-50 with the latest additives for very good cold starts and economy (less friction) and also the best in terms of "Schlammbildung" (oil mud).

I have somewere more data about the oil behavior (viscosity ) in low middle and high temperatures but cant find it right now! If someone had some time maybe he could give us this information! It on the websites of the oil companys!

[alg]

We have had this debate many, many times and they can all be reviewed using the search function.
Fully synthetic, within OEM spec, changed on 5K-6K basis with new filter is the summary. That is more important than the conflicting views re 0-40 15-50 10-60 Mobil vs Castrol vs Millers IMHO.
I have recently started using Mazola oil but I am finding it difficult to get my chips out of the filler cap when they are done

[dan_b]

@Ross - I ordered mine from the Millers Oils website and it arrived next day delivery (I also purchased 2 bottles of CVL Turbo octane booster too, hee hee) so I have my oil for the Garage Meet.

Regarding intervals - probably the rule of thumb is "the more regular the better", but also a lot depends on what sort of driving you do - lots of short journies, lots of hard thrashing when cold will require more frequent changing than regular, warm driving constant speed motorway driving. I changed my oil last Feb, and have done 9000 miles since then, which is probably a bit too much for my car with my driving patterns.

Definitely don't want to go longer than 12 months and 10,000 miles without a change.

[S2Roo]

Those figures of 1.5-1.8 bar at idle, and 4 bar at full load are similar to what I see with the synta silver, and it the fear of these figures dropping to similar values you saw with the synta gold that has stopped me trying other oils. If you are getting the 1.5-1.8 bar at idle, and 4 bar at full load Millers CFS 10-60 I think I may try this oil.

[alg]

i am going to use the M1 5w-50 in the next days! Tere was a big debate in a german forum about oils and there was someone that really had a clue on the oils and said that the Castrol RS 10w-60 is very bad in terms of cold start ect! Said that its additive pack is also not the last one! Said also that th eCastrol TWS 10-60 is a little better but also not the best choice! Said this oil is only good for Race cars that get really abused and did have to start several times a day with a cold engine!

According to him the State of The Art oil right now is the Mobil 1 5w-50 with the latest additives for very good cold starts and economy (less friction) and also the best in terms of "Schlammbildung" (oil mud).

I have somewere more data about the oil behavior (viscosity ) in low middle and high temperatures but cant find it right now! If someone had some time maybe he could give us this information! It on the websites of the oil companys!

Yes but you gain cold start protection at the expense of high temperature protection. It really is swings and roundabouts unless you live at the extremes of climate......like say Skegness (which is always wet..so which oil to use )